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US should return to isolationism now. It never was an actual superpower. It just convincingly played one from a distance. Nearly every US engagement in recent t

US should return to isolationism now. It never was an actual superpower. It just convincingly played one from a distance. Nearly every US engagement in recent times just shown how inapt US is at effecting anything anywhere through military action. US getting directly involved in Ukraine will just clearly show vast scale of US military incompetence to China and anyone who could still have any doubts.

willcipriano 2y ago
You are being down voted by people who lost every war they fought.
7thaccount 2y ago
This is nonsense. The US advising Ukraine and supplying s limited amount of weapons has allowed them to hold out against Russia when they were supposed to collapse in a week. If anything, this war has shown Russia to be a paper tiger. They're literally resorting to WW2 era tanks at this point. Keep in mind that Russia and the US are both nuclear powers, so that complicates things as neither Putin, Biden, or Zelensky want nukes being thrown around.
- riehwvfbk 2y ago
  Can we decide which is it? Paper tiger or "a threat to all of Europe so we should increase defense spending 50x"?
  - 7thaccount 2y ago
    Paper tiger compared to the US. Between the US's actually functioning carriers, F-22s, modern tanks, and finally functional JSFs...I don't think Russia's untrained cannon fodder being supplied by civilian vans is going to win out. That being said, the democratic countries in Eastern europe are tiny and most have a very small military presence. Without NATO, Russia could conceivably storm into those countries. I don't think there is a good answer here. Either let Putin steamroll a chunk of Europe or spend a ton of additional taxpayer dollars. A little googling suggests the U.S. support for Ukraine is 1.5% of our federal budget, which is crazy high if you think about it. Isolationism has its benefits and drawbacks of course.
    - scotty79 2y ago
      > A little googling suggests the U.S. support for Ukraine is 1.5% of our federal budget, which is crazy high if you think about it. Isn't it surprising how little this mountain of money achieves? It just slows down Russia at the unsustainable cost of Ukrainian lives. Maybe US budget is so huge for other reasons than their military prowess? Maybe everything US does is just vastly overpriced for its value? Could American military be even more overpriced than American healtcare?
      - 7thaccount 2y ago
        I'm just saying it's a ton of money. We didn't just donate a few billion and call it quits. I think part of this is viewed as an ongoing expense where we're constantly giving someone weapons (Israel, Ukraine, whoever) in order to keep the Defense industry in business. It is a roundabout way to give our tax dollars to Raytheon and other firms without directly giving it to them. Slowing down Russia at the cost of Ukrainian lives is a decision for them to make. You might feel differently if your country was being invaded. The US citizen should get a vote though if they're paying through taxes and inflation. Overpriced? Almost certainly. Government isn't efficient. It's run much more efficiently than Russia or China though where much of the funding is siphoned off due to corruption. We don't appear to have that problem at least, although the Pentagon constantly failing audits is suspicious and something we do need to look into.
    - riehwvfbk 2y ago
      If we are being intellectually honest though, the "chunk of Europe" in question is Moldova, but they want you to think it's Portugal.
      - 7thaccount 2y ago
        Yeah. I think there was some concern over Finland, but they just joined NATO.
        scotty79 2y ago

willcipriano 2y ago

You are being down voted by people who lost every war they fought.

7thaccount 2y ago

This is nonsense. The US advising Ukraine and supplying s limited amount of weapons has allowed them to hold out against Russia when they were supposed to collapse in a week. If anything, this war has shown Russia to be a paper tiger. They're literally resorting to WW2 era tanks at this point. Keep in mind that Russia and the US are both nuclear powers, so that complicates things as neither Putin, Biden, or Zelensky want nukes being thrown around.

riehwvfbk 2y ago
Can we decide which is it? Paper tiger or "a threat to all of Europe so we should increase defense spending 50x"?
- 7thaccount 2y ago
  Paper tiger compared to the US. Between the US's actually functioning carriers, F-22s, modern tanks, and finally functional JSFs...I don't think Russia's untrained cannon fodder being supplied by civilian vans is going to win out. That being said, the democratic countries in Eastern europe are tiny and most have a very small military presence. Without NATO, Russia could conceivably storm into those countries. I don't think there is a good answer here. Either let Putin steamroll a chunk of Europe or spend a ton of additional taxpayer dollars. A little googling suggests the U.S. support for Ukraine is 1.5% of our federal budget, which is crazy high if you think about it. Isolationism has its benefits and drawbacks of course.
  - scotty79 2y ago
    > A little googling suggests the U.S. support for Ukraine is 1.5% of our federal budget, which is crazy high if you think about it. Isn't it surprising how little this mountain of money achieves? It just slows down Russia at the unsustainable cost of Ukrainian lives. Maybe US budget is so huge for other reasons than their military prowess? Maybe everything US does is just vastly overpriced for its value? Could American military be even more overpriced than American healtcare?
    - 7thaccount 2y ago
      I'm just saying it's a ton of money. We didn't just donate a few billion and call it quits. I think part of this is viewed as an ongoing expense where we're constantly giving someone weapons (Israel, Ukraine, whoever) in order to keep the Defense industry in business. It is a roundabout way to give our tax dollars to Raytheon and other firms without directly giving it to them. Slowing down Russia at the cost of Ukrainian lives is a decision for them to make. You might feel differently if your country was being invaded. The US citizen should get a vote though if they're paying through taxes and inflation. Overpriced? Almost certainly. Government isn't efficient. It's run much more efficiently than Russia or China though where much of the funding is siphoned off due to corruption. We don't appear to have that problem at least, although the Pentagon constantly failing audits is suspicious and something we do need to look into.
  - riehwvfbk 2y ago
    If we are being intellectually honest though, the "chunk of Europe" in question is Moldova, but they want you to think it's Portugal.
    - 7thaccount 2y ago
      Yeah. I think there was some concern over Finland, but they just joined NATO.
      - scotty79 2y ago