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The standard of living in Japan for the vast majority of people is orders of magnitude better than it is here. It might not look good according to metrics that

The standard of living in Japan for the vast majority of people is orders of magnitude better than it is here. It might not look good according to metrics that optimize ploughing society's wealth into the hands of a few billionaires, but it says something that an Uber delivery person can live walking distance to the popular restaurants that he delivers from.

throw0101d 2y ago
> The standard of living in Japan for the vast majority of people is orders of magnitude better than it is here. But is that because of their economic policy or because of social norms? > It might not look good according to metrics that optimize ploughing society's wealth into the hands of a few billionaires […] Sweden also has a pretty good standard of living, less inequality than the US, decent economic growth (better than JP, lower than US), and has more billionaires on a per capita basis than the US: * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_number_of_billionaires https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_number_of...
- staunton 2y ago
  > But is that because of their economic policy or because of social norms? You think the distribution of living standards across a population could be a matter of social norms? How?
  - throw0101d 2y ago
    > You think the distribution of living standards across a population could be a matter of social norms? How? Taxation and social programs: * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Redistribution_of_income_and_wealth https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Redistribution_of_income_and_w... People choose to vote for / elect people who are willing to implement various policies to achieve it. What is acceptable to the population is (partly?) determined by the norms of that population and society, and the acceptance of various ideas will determine what politicians will campaign for.
    - thfuran 2y ago
      But that's economic policy, even if it is at least in part driven by social norms.
      - throw0101b 2y ago
        > But that's economic policy, even if it is at least in part driven by social norms. Social norms come first, and they determine which economic policies you are willing to even consider (and then implement or not). * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overton_window https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overton_window
        omegaworks 2y ago
        Japan's economic system was crafted in post-war reconstruction by General MacArthur. It's literally the furthest you can get from "social norms precede policy."
        throw0101d 2y ago
        > Japan's economic system was crafted in post-war reconstruction by General MacArthur. Japan's economic system has been under Japanese control and self-determined (for both good and ill) for decades: * https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/16144575-how-asia-works https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/16144575-how-asia-works
UncleOxidant 2y ago
Lots of things about the Japanese standard of living have little to nothing to do with monetary policy. Being able to park your bike just about anywhere without locking it up and without worrying about it being stolen, for example.
- omegaworks 2y ago
  >have little to nothing to do with monetary policy. False. A monetary policy that prioritizes universal access to basic needs leads to less overall crime. It may not be sufficient, but it is a major factor[1]. 1. https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-020-80897-8 https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-020-80897-8
mitthrowaway2 2y ago
I think you're both right. IMO, Japan has a very high standard of living, but they could also be better off today if they'd been looser with fiscal spending (and spent that fresh-printed money wisely). For example, one of their major issues is an aging population; they could have directed spending towards subsidizing childcare, fertility treatment, parental leave subsidies, or even offering a salary to stay-at-home parents, to compensate and incentivize that valuable work. (They do have some of these policies, but their low inflation suggests they had room to do much more!)

throw0101d 2y ago

> The standard of living in Japan for the vast majority of people is orders of magnitude better than it is here. But is that because of their economic policy or because of social norms? > It might not look good according to metrics that optimize ploughing society's wealth into the hands of a few billionaires […] Sweden also has a pretty good standard of living, less inequality than the US, decent economic growth (better than JP, lower than US), and has more billionaires on a per capita basis than the US: * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_number_of_billionaires https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_number_of...

staunton 2y ago
> But is that because of their economic policy or because of social norms? You think the distribution of living standards across a population could be a matter of social norms? How?
- throw0101d 2y ago
  > You think the distribution of living standards across a population could be a matter of social norms? How? Taxation and social programs: * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Redistribution_of_income_and_wealth https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Redistribution_of_income_and_w... People choose to vote for / elect people who are willing to implement various policies to achieve it. What is acceptable to the population is (partly?) determined by the norms of that population and society, and the acceptance of various ideas will determine what politicians will campaign for.
  - thfuran 2y ago
    But that's economic policy, even if it is at least in part driven by social norms.
    - throw0101b 2y ago
      > But that's economic policy, even if it is at least in part driven by social norms. Social norms come first, and they determine which economic policies you are willing to even consider (and then implement or not). * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overton_window https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overton_window
      - omegaworks 2y ago
        Japan's economic system was crafted in post-war reconstruction by General MacArthur. It's literally the furthest you can get from "social norms precede policy."
        throw0101d 2y ago
        > Japan's economic system was crafted in post-war reconstruction by General MacArthur. Japan's economic system has been under Japanese control and self-determined (for both good and ill) for decades: * https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/16144575-how-asia-works https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/16144575-how-asia-works

UncleOxidant 2y ago

Lots of things about the Japanese standard of living have little to nothing to do with monetary policy. Being able to park your bike just about anywhere without locking it up and without worrying about it being stolen, for example.

omegaworks 2y ago
>have little to nothing to do with monetary policy. False. A monetary policy that prioritizes universal access to basic needs leads to less overall crime. It may not be sufficient, but it is a major factor[1]. 1. https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-020-80897-8 https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-020-80897-8

mitthrowaway2 2y ago

I think you're both right. IMO, Japan has a very high standard of living, but they could also be better off today if they'd been looser with fiscal spending (and spent that fresh-printed money wisely). For example, one of their major issues is an aging population; they could have directed spending towards subsidizing childcare, fertility treatment, parental leave subsidies, or even offering a salary to stay-at-home parents, to compensate and incentivize that valuable work. (They do have some of these policies, but their low inflation suggests they had room to do much more!)