4 ms·

Just do the things you or your kids want to do and not the things that you or your kids don't want to do, doesn't seem that hard in this case... Nobody's twist

Just do the things you or your kids want to do and not the things that you or your kids don't want to do, doesn't seem that hard in this case... Nobody's twisting your arm, forcing you to spend more time than you want to at these activities other than your feeling of obligation to your children... Don't complain, just don't go..

beart 2y ago
The issue with this mentality is it ultimately leads to doing nothing at all. It's incredibly easy to look at an obligation and turn it down, even if it will benefit you and your family. My kids would love to do nothing but play video games all day long. Honestly, so would I. But I coach them in sports because it gets me involved, gets me out of the house, and teaches them a ton of valuable lessons. Lessons I wish I had learned.
- avmich 2y ago
  > The issue with this mentality is it ultimately leads to doing nothing at all. Not necessarily - but too often to be important. Surely kids left alone would do wonderful things by themselves... if they figure out what are those wonderful things they'd like to do. Most often they don't know. Have no idea what are those wonderful activities, which they like, and which they can participate, or solo, in, and how to organize whatever is needed. Now it's the ball in our court - and we don't have a good solution for how to present those opportunities to kids, so that they'd not just sit and figure nothing interesting to do, and get distracted with more passive things, like TVs or videogames, but something which strikes a better balance between enjoyment and benefits in learning. It's interesting that the problem is literally ages old - yet we as civilization still have rather crude solutions for what to offer our kids so they'd grow involved and benefiting from learning opportunities. Seems like a good topic for a targeted efforts for a company or a non-profit, if government is moving too slow.
- spicyusername 2y ago
  Then it sounds like that's an obligation you do want to do, and will go to. But later, if you change your mind... then don't go.
  - beart 2y ago
    I changed my kids diapers, if I didn't they would smell and get a rash. Having a good reason to do something isn't the same thing as wanting to do it for purely pleasurable reasons. But that's the whole point isn't it? Approaching things as, "if you don't want to do it, then don't" can lead to a whole lot of bad outcomes.
CharlieDigital 2y ago
My daughter hated, HATED, gymnastics for a period when she was younger. She would kick and scream on the ground when we took her. Part of it was that the coaches were old-school, Eastern European gymnasts. Part of it was the timing -- right after school when she probably wanted to nap. Wife and I debated long and hard whether we should just let her quit but decided to keep her in it because she showed some talent for it. It wasn't easy because we effectively "forced" her to do gymnastics even as she would kick and scream and cry on some days just getting into the car. Some days I'd complain to my wife why we bother with this because she clearly doesn't want to do it. This past weekend? She placed first all-around in her division at a regional competition. We got her an adjustable dumbbell set this past Christmas and she trains every night on her own volition. She hates missing gymnastics now because that's her happy place now. I'd say it's part of her identity now. I think sometimes, kids don't want to do things because they aren't good at it. But they can't become proficient at anything without a lot of practice and training be that an instrument or a sport. And with that proficiency comes enjoyment and engagement. It's not so black and white as you propose; sometimes there's a judgement call to be made to start the ramp of proficiency that feeds into enjoyment and achievement.
- mdorazio 2y ago
  The trouble with this is that you don't have any data for the alternative case, so you can't say if forcing her to do gymnastics was actually a good move. Maybe she would have loved piano even more and been performing at concerts now. Maybe she would have loved soccer and been on a path to the Olympics. Personally, I think forcing kids to do an activity after they've tried it a few times and decided they hate it is generally a bad tactic. I'm a fan of giving kids options - they have to do something that gets them out of the house and off their phone / iPad, but not necessarily the thing I personally think they should do.
  - CharlieDigital 2y ago
    I don't think we would have kept going if she didn't show some ability. But because she showed some ability (balance, flexibility), we pushed it a bit more and it worked out for us.

beart 2y ago

The issue with this mentality is it ultimately leads to doing nothing at all. It's incredibly easy to look at an obligation and turn it down, even if it will benefit you and your family. My kids would love to do nothing but play video games all day long. Honestly, so would I. But I coach them in sports because it gets me involved, gets me out of the house, and teaches them a ton of valuable lessons. Lessons I wish I had learned.

avmich 2y ago
> The issue with this mentality is it ultimately leads to doing nothing at all. Not necessarily - but too often to be important. Surely kids left alone would do wonderful things by themselves... if they figure out what are those wonderful things they'd like to do. Most often they don't know. Have no idea what are those wonderful activities, which they like, and which they can participate, or solo, in, and how to organize whatever is needed. Now it's the ball in our court - and we don't have a good solution for how to present those opportunities to kids, so that they'd not just sit and figure nothing interesting to do, and get distracted with more passive things, like TVs or videogames, but something which strikes a better balance between enjoyment and benefits in learning. It's interesting that the problem is literally ages old - yet we as civilization still have rather crude solutions for what to offer our kids so they'd grow involved and benefiting from learning opportunities. Seems like a good topic for a targeted efforts for a company or a non-profit, if government is moving too slow.
spicyusername 2y ago
Then it sounds like that's an obligation you do want to do, and will go to. But later, if you change your mind... then don't go.
- beart 2y ago
  I changed my kids diapers, if I didn't they would smell and get a rash. Having a good reason to do something isn't the same thing as wanting to do it for purely pleasurable reasons. But that's the whole point isn't it? Approaching things as, "if you don't want to do it, then don't" can lead to a whole lot of bad outcomes.

CharlieDigital 2y ago

My daughter hated, HATED, gymnastics for a period when she was younger. She would kick and scream on the ground when we took her. Part of it was that the coaches were old-school, Eastern European gymnasts. Part of it was the timing -- right after school when she probably wanted to nap. Wife and I debated long and hard whether we should just let her quit but decided to keep her in it because she showed some talent for it. It wasn't easy because we effectively "forced" her to do gymnastics even as she would kick and scream and cry on some days just getting into the car. Some days I'd complain to my wife why we bother with this because she clearly doesn't want to do it. This past weekend? She placed first all-around in her division at a regional competition. We got her an adjustable dumbbell set this past Christmas and she trains every night on her own volition. She hates missing gymnastics now because that's her happy place now. I'd say it's part of her identity now. I think sometimes, kids don't want to do things because they aren't good at it. But they can't become proficient at anything without a lot of practice and training be that an instrument or a sport. And with that proficiency comes enjoyment and engagement. It's not so black and white as you propose; sometimes there's a judgement call to be made to start the ramp of proficiency that feeds into enjoyment and achievement.

mdorazio 2y ago
The trouble with this is that you don't have any data for the alternative case, so you can't say if forcing her to do gymnastics was actually a good move. Maybe she would have loved piano even more and been performing at concerts now. Maybe she would have loved soccer and been on a path to the Olympics. Personally, I think forcing kids to do an activity after they've tried it a few times and decided they hate it is generally a bad tactic. I'm a fan of giving kids options - they have to do something that gets them out of the house and off their phone / iPad, but not necessarily the thing I personally think they should do.
- CharlieDigital 2y ago
  I don't think we would have kept going if she didn't show some ability. But because she showed some ability (balance, flexibility), we pushed it a bit more and it worked out for us.