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I think you're invoking a liberarian argument where nobody is entitled to the fruits of your labor except for you. That means it's none of government's business

I think you're invoking a liberarian argument where nobody is entitled to the fruits of your labor except for you. That means it's none of government's business to know how much money you have or who you transact with. Tornado Cash made this sort of ideal possible on Bitcoin.

mistrial9 2y ago
probably meant to say "libertarian" .. and to put a finer point on it, the government with jurisdiction over trade does indeed get to know how much money is traded with, and with whom.. on the reporting decided on by regulation.. not a wholesale dragnet monitoring of every transaction and every account balance. Meanwhile, modern finance is such that financial products are unequal, especially over borders, so the right to trade money and the like over time is included in legal definitions of private property. .. something like that.. ?
readyman 2y ago
>a liberarian argument where nobody is entitled to the fruits of your labor except for you There simply is no fruit which is the product of one's labor, whether it be one person or one enterprise. Any honest analysis must start here.
- stirfish 2y ago
  I don't know what you mean.
  - readyman 2y ago
    We live in a society. All our knowledge and labor is dependent on prior knowledge and labor of our neighbors and those who came before us, also known as our society.
- refurb 2y ago
  Clearly falsifiable. If I harvest a random apple growing wild, that my labor alone. But I know where you’re going with that argument - everyone’s work is built upon someone else’s so…the government is entitled to all of it.
  - readyman 2y ago
    >If I harvest a random apple growing wild, that my labor alone. Nonsense. It takes a village to raise a child, and the agricultural knowledge to harvest anything stands on the shoulders of approximately all of human history.
    - refurb 2y ago
      An apple growing wild on a tree? Please share the "agricultural knowledge" require to pluck a ripe, wild apple? No. Man can harvest nature with his own labor and profit from it. Alone, with only his own work. I know that fact burns a certain side of the political spectrum, but it's the truth.
      - readyman 2y ago
        Under capitalism, this is called theft.
  - danaris 2y ago
    Who planted that apple tree? Who owns the land it grows on? If you own it, how did you buy it? Who brought apple seeds to the continent where you plucked it? Who raised you to the point that you were able to pluck that apple? Who built the roads that you drove on to get close to the apple tree? The car you drove? Who ensures that the air and water are clean enough for apple trees to grow there? The problem with any manufactured scenario such as this is that it narrows the focus down to a single act, and tries to claim that that is the entire system. It never is. The system has no beginning or end, and must be considered far beyond a single act if you are to meaningfully understand what supports it and just how interdependent it is or isn't.
    - refurb 2y ago
      LOL. You can't picture a scenario where early man plucks a wild apple? Or that tree naturally replicate themselves? The fact you ask about how they drove there made me chuckle.

mistrial9 2y ago

probably meant to say "libertarian" .. and to put a finer point on it, the government with jurisdiction over trade does indeed get to know how much money is traded with, and with whom.. on the reporting decided on by regulation.. not a wholesale dragnet monitoring of every transaction and every account balance. Meanwhile, modern finance is such that financial products are unequal, especially over borders, so the right to trade money and the like over time is included in legal definitions of private property. .. something like that.. ?

readyman 2y ago

>a liberarian argument where nobody is entitled to the fruits of your labor except for you There simply is no fruit which is the product of one's labor, whether it be one person or one enterprise. Any honest analysis must start here.

stirfish 2y ago
I don't know what you mean.
- readyman 2y ago
  We live in a society. All our knowledge and labor is dependent on prior knowledge and labor of our neighbors and those who came before us, also known as our society.
refurb 2y ago
Clearly falsifiable. If I harvest a random apple growing wild, that my labor alone. But I know where you’re going with that argument - everyone’s work is built upon someone else’s so…the government is entitled to all of it.
- readyman 2y ago
  >If I harvest a random apple growing wild, that my labor alone. Nonsense. It takes a village to raise a child, and the agricultural knowledge to harvest anything stands on the shoulders of approximately all of human history.
  - refurb 2y ago
    An apple growing wild on a tree? Please share the "agricultural knowledge" require to pluck a ripe, wild apple? No. Man can harvest nature with his own labor and profit from it. Alone, with only his own work. I know that fact burns a certain side of the political spectrum, but it's the truth.
    - readyman 2y ago
      Under capitalism, this is called theft.
- danaris 2y ago
  Who planted that apple tree? Who owns the land it grows on? If you own it, how did you buy it? Who brought apple seeds to the continent where you plucked it? Who raised you to the point that you were able to pluck that apple? Who built the roads that you drove on to get close to the apple tree? The car you drove? Who ensures that the air and water are clean enough for apple trees to grow there? The problem with any manufactured scenario such as this is that it narrows the focus down to a single act, and tries to claim that that is the entire system. It never is. The system has no beginning or end, and must be considered far beyond a single act if you are to meaningfully understand what supports it and just how interdependent it is or isn't.
  - refurb 2y ago
    LOL. You can't picture a scenario where early man plucks a wild apple? Or that tree naturally replicate themselves? The fact you ask about how they drove there made me chuckle.