3 ms·

If it did turn out that Apple was actually able to do what they claim they can't, how would you explain the source that you linked to?

• CharlesW 2y ago
  > If it did turn out that Apple was actually able to do what they claim they can't… My friend, I'm afraid I have no idea what you mean. What do you believe Apple claims they can't do that conflicts with this? (If your answer is "end-to-end encryption", Apple has supported this for at least a decade.)
  • imwillofficial 2y ago
    I think what the poster is getting at is: "How do we validate claims of end-to-end encryption?" It is a lot of trust to place in a company. I would be curious if there are ways to test Apple's claims?
    • Sporktacular 2y ago
      It's not just trust in a company. Matthew Green was geeking out about iCloud Keychain privacy a few years ago. He sometimes speaks of contacts in Apple security who are really committed and competent engineers. Their professional reputations are on the line too. Nothing would damage their careers like a backdoor that conspiracy types love to speculate on.
    • CharlesW 2y ago
      > "How do we validate claims of end-to-end encryption?" I'm not a security expert, and you can't prove a negative, so AFAIK the only evidence is the lack of reported incidents where Apple's iCloud Keychain data has been directly hacked or compromised. Given that iOS and iDevices are among the highest-value targets for hackers and nation-states, that seems like reasonably solid evidence. From a business perspective, lying about such a thing would have virtually zero upside but unimaginably massive downside. It's a great Apple-hater fantasy, though.
      • Teever 2y ago
        > so AFAIK the only evidence is the lack of reported incidents Thank you. That's exactly what I wanted to hear from you. The link you provided is in no way, shape or form actual evidence of what you're suggesting. > From a business perspective, lying about such a thing would have virtually zero upside but unimaginably massive downside. What are users going to do? Buy a Surface tablet and a Samsung phone? > It's a great Apple-hater fantasy, though. I just dipped my toe into the Apple waters again and bought an m1 air a year or so go. I'm currently shopping for a used iPhone. I don't have brand loyalty and I use what works, and it just so happens that Apple has been making stuff that works pretty well in my opinion recently. But I'm under no illusion that I can trust them.
  • lightedman 2y ago
    Apple claims they cannot decrypt. What will you do if that claim turns out false? That is what the person you are talking with means, and it is very clear throughout the conversation.
    • CharlesW 2y ago
      Great, so what does he mean by "how would you explain the source that you linked to?", since no part of that conflicts with what I've said or anything else? (I really appreciate the parsing help!)
      • lightedman 2y ago
        The source you linked to makes one claim yet you can't verify that claim - that's what they mean. And we have plenty of historical examples, including recent ones, that big companies are simply lying through their teeth almost every time they open their mouths. Companies that rely heavily upon marketing are lying more so than others. "Macs don't get viruses" claim made while several Mac viruses existed at the time. It's been lies for decades.
• r00fus 2y ago
  Posing a hypothetical without any evidence of that being true is not a valid rebuttal.