7 ms·

> On July 20, 2018, Walter Forbes was released from the Federal Correctional Institute, Otisville in New York, a medium-security prison later to be occupied by

> On July 20, 2018, Walter Forbes was released from the Federal Correctional Institute, Otisville in New York, a medium-security prison later to be occupied by Michael Cohen, the Situation, and Fyre Festival’s Billy McFarland. Forbes was convicted in 2007—after two mistrials—on one count of conspiracy to commit securities fraud and two counts of making false statements, and sentenced to 151 months in prison and to make restitution in the order of $3.28 billion. The house he’d transferred to his wife was returned to him, by court order, to be divvied up between the government and Cendant. > Kirk Shelton was sentenced to 10 years and the same amount in restitution. How can someone destroy a company like Sierra Online that touched millions of lives and ever get out of prison? A better system would be to standardize a number of dollars of fraud is equal to a day is jail, and then just do the math to determine the jail time.

adolph 2y ago
> Walter Forbes was released from the Federal Correctional Institute, Otisville in New York, a medium-security prison later to be occupied by Michael Cohen, the Situation, and Fyre Festival’s Billy McFarland I’m surprised that the BoP is so relaxed about prisoner privacy, also that there hasn’t been a reality TV show in this prison.
- currymj 2y ago
  generally it has to be public knowledge which prisons people are in, because the alternative would be really bad (people “disappear”).
- zoky 2y ago
  > I’m surprised that the BoP is so relaxed about prisoner privacy There’s no such thing, at least not in terms of who is in what prison. Courts determine prison sentences, and since court records are public, prison records are public. If you know the name of an inmate you can find out what their sentence is, where they are incarcerated, expected release date, etc.
zmgsabst 2y ago
I’m a big proponent we should apply the value of a life — about $10M. Financial crimes should be scaled so the penalties for doing $10M in damage are equivalent to 1 dead person. Do a billion in damage? You’re going away forever, the same as someone who sets off a bomb killing a hundred people. I think we’d solve a lot of our problems if we accepted money as life-equivalent in both directions, ie, not only as a value when a wrongful death occurs.
- s1artibartfast 2y ago
  I think the crimes are categorically different, and you can't compare them in that manner. There is no singular "the value of life". There are numbers which some people use in very specific circumstances. Prices for life are subjective. I would say mine is priceless, and might say yours is much cheaper. When you take someones life, they don't have a chance to put a price to it.
  - GavinMcG 2y ago
    Do any of those reasons weigh against measuring the seriousness of financial crimes in terms of actuarial lives? No problem with the objection that lives are priceless, but couldn’t the inverse still be a useful lens?
    - s1artibartfast 2y ago
      I dont think it is useful at all. They are categorically different. There is single plunishment for lives lost in the legal system either. It depends on many things like intent. A life lost could range from life in prison to no punishment at all. Same for financial crime, and each depend on like 10 factors.
- yard2010 2y ago
  I would argue no money could buy life. If you lose your money you are still alive. If you lose your life, you lose the money too.
  - 2y ago
s1artibartfast 2y ago
What would be the point. More time in jail doesn't fix anything. Sentencing guidelines actually are based on the amount. I just don't think it is linear. Last, in reality, it isn't just about the number, but the harm done. Stealing a penny from 300 million people is very different than stealing 3 million from one person in terms of impact.

adolph 2y ago

> Walter Forbes was released from the Federal Correctional Institute, Otisville in New York, a medium-security prison later to be occupied by Michael Cohen, the Situation, and Fyre Festival’s Billy McFarland I’m surprised that the BoP is so relaxed about prisoner privacy, also that there hasn’t been a reality TV show in this prison.

currymj 2y ago
generally it has to be public knowledge which prisons people are in, because the alternative would be really bad (people “disappear”).
zoky 2y ago
> I’m surprised that the BoP is so relaxed about prisoner privacy There’s no such thing, at least not in terms of who is in what prison. Courts determine prison sentences, and since court records are public, prison records are public. If you know the name of an inmate you can find out what their sentence is, where they are incarcerated, expected release date, etc.

zmgsabst 2y ago

I’m a big proponent we should apply the value of a life — about $10M. Financial crimes should be scaled so the penalties for doing $10M in damage are equivalent to 1 dead person. Do a billion in damage? You’re going away forever, the same as someone who sets off a bomb killing a hundred people. I think we’d solve a lot of our problems if we accepted money as life-equivalent in both directions, ie, not only as a value when a wrongful death occurs.

s1artibartfast 2y ago
I think the crimes are categorically different, and you can't compare them in that manner. There is no singular "the value of life". There are numbers which some people use in very specific circumstances. Prices for life are subjective. I would say mine is priceless, and might say yours is much cheaper. When you take someones life, they don't have a chance to put a price to it.
- GavinMcG 2y ago
  Do any of those reasons weigh against measuring the seriousness of financial crimes in terms of actuarial lives? No problem with the objection that lives are priceless, but couldn’t the inverse still be a useful lens?
  - s1artibartfast 2y ago
    I dont think it is useful at all. They are categorically different. There is single plunishment for lives lost in the legal system either. It depends on many things like intent. A life lost could range from life in prison to no punishment at all. Same for financial crime, and each depend on like 10 factors.
yard2010 2y ago
I would argue no money could buy life. If you lose your money you are still alive. If you lose your life, you lose the money too.
- 2y ago

s1artibartfast 2y ago

What would be the point. More time in jail doesn't fix anything. Sentencing guidelines actually are based on the amount. I just don't think it is linear. Last, in reality, it isn't just about the number, but the harm done. Stealing a penny from 300 million people is very different than stealing 3 million from one person in terms of impact.