4 ms·

I'm not going to back up these claims in any other way than pointing the "interesting alternative" programs that appear in some comparisons, which tend to be fa

by lrem 14y ago

I'm not going to back up these claims in any other way than pointing the "interesting alternative" programs that appear in some comparisons, which tend to be faster than the chosen versions. For example here: http://shootout.alioth.debian.org/u64q/benchmark.php?test=fannkuchredux&lang=all http://shootout.alioth.debian.org/u64q/benchmark.php?test=fa... Both Lisp and Java alternatives are faster than the "fastest" solution (written in Fortran). Finding any more support for the years-old opinion I voiced seems too much work to be worth it.

igouy 14y ago
So we can immediately dismiss your "Programs are not meant to be written in idiomatic language. They are meant to resemble the C implementation." claims as baseless. The only example you chose shows programs that manually unroll loops are not accepted. (And that's stated explicitly on the Help page. http://shootout.alioth.debian.org/help.php#unroll http://shootout.alioth.debian.org/help.php#unroll)
- lrem 14y ago
  Yes, you can. Just one last mention: my opinion was formed in the times I used Perl and looked around the actual implementations of these. But that was years ago. It was reinforced quite recently by someone whining (probably on HN) about the same things. Apart from these anecdotes, I have no basis for these words.
  - igouy 14y ago
    > But that was years ago. It's a sad nuisance when people opine without checking what's actually shown on a public website. It's sad to see fact based comments being down voted on HN.
    - lrem 14y ago
      > It's a sad nuisance when people opine without checking what's actually shown on a public website. Well, I could simply ignore the question. Or give the answer I got a few years ago, what I did... > It's sad to see fact based comments being down voted on HN. Fact based? More like facts querying. Which is the reason I upvoted every single of your comments...
      - igouy 14y ago
        > Which is the reason I upvoted every single of your comments. And yet people have down voted.
- chromatic 14y ago
  "... we ask that contributed programs not only give the correct result, but also use the same algorithm to calculate that result." (Except for meteor-contest.)
  - igouy 14y ago
    I'm sure you wish to make a point -- please don't make everyone guess what you mean, just spell it out.
    - chromatic 14y ago
      An algorithm that's idiomatic in one language might be terribly unidiomatic in another. (I'm sure you know this, but) Haskell's pervasive laziness makes some algorithms tractable while requiring a lot of space/time complexity for other algorithms.
      - igouy 14y ago
        The benchmarks game URL was posted by someone who has put a lot of energy into promoting Haskell - dons makes the best of the opportunity that the benchmarks game provides to promote Haskell. >>pervasive laziness... requiring a lot of space/time complexity for other algorithms<< And GHC provides strictness analysis and explicit strictness to avoid reducing performance. http://www.haskell.org/haskellwiki/Performance/Strictness http://www.haskell.org/haskellwiki/Performance/Strictness
      - igouy 14y ago
        >>I need some sort of shock collar to teach me not to argue about the worth of the Computer Language Benchmarks Game.<< Do argue - but argue better. Unfortunately, to argue better does require learning what the website says about the benchmarks game - and for most that's far too much effort.

by lrem 14y ago

igouy 14y ago

So we can immediately dismiss your "Programs are not meant to be written in idiomatic language. They are meant to resemble the C implementation." claims as baseless. The only example you chose shows programs that manually unroll loops are not accepted. (And that's stated explicitly on the Help page. http://shootout.alioth.debian.org/help.php#unroll http://shootout.alioth.debian.org/help.php#unroll)

lrem 14y ago
Yes, you can. Just one last mention: my opinion was formed in the times I used Perl and looked around the actual implementations of these. But that was years ago. It was reinforced quite recently by someone whining (probably on HN) about the same things. Apart from these anecdotes, I have no basis for these words.
- igouy 14y ago
  > But that was years ago. It's a sad nuisance when people opine without checking what's actually shown on a public website. It's sad to see fact based comments being down voted on HN.
  - lrem 14y ago
    > It's a sad nuisance when people opine without checking what's actually shown on a public website. Well, I could simply ignore the question. Or give the answer I got a few years ago, what I did... > It's sad to see fact based comments being down voted on HN. Fact based? More like facts querying. Which is the reason I upvoted every single of your comments...
    - igouy 14y ago
      > Which is the reason I upvoted every single of your comments. And yet people have down voted.
chromatic 14y ago
"... we ask that contributed programs not only give the correct result, but also use the same algorithm to calculate that result." (Except for meteor-contest.)
- igouy 14y ago
  I'm sure you wish to make a point -- please don't make everyone guess what you mean, just spell it out.
  - chromatic 14y ago
    An algorithm that's idiomatic in one language might be terribly unidiomatic in another. (I'm sure you know this, but) Haskell's pervasive laziness makes some algorithms tractable while requiring a lot of space/time complexity for other algorithms.
    - igouy 14y ago
      The benchmarks game URL was posted by someone who has put a lot of energy into promoting Haskell - dons makes the best of the opportunity that the benchmarks game provides to promote Haskell. >>pervasive laziness... requiring a lot of space/time complexity for other algorithms<< And GHC provides strictness analysis and explicit strictness to avoid reducing performance. http://www.haskell.org/haskellwiki/Performance/Strictness http://www.haskell.org/haskellwiki/Performance/Strictness
    - igouy 14y ago
      >>I need some sort of shock collar to teach me not to argue about the worth of the Computer Language Benchmarks Game.<< Do argue - but argue better. Unfortunately, to argue better does require learning what the website says about the benchmarks game - and for most that's far too much effort.