4 ms·

You throw in left-leaning socialist and liberal-conservative as if it's supposed to clarify the story. Both of those terms meant vastly different things from no

You throw in left-leaning socialist and liberal-conservative as if it's supposed to clarify the story. Both of those terms meant vastly different things from now 50 years ago. Can you be a bit more precise with your 2 cents so we can actually understand what you're saying? Social Democracy isn't "socialist left", but leaving that aside, what you're saying is that the social democrats of the time tried to create energy independence(opposite of today's social democrats by the way), that's smart. So the Austrian people's party invested into what exactly? What did they do? I see that he was in the Willy Brandt camp who was famous for his Ostpolitik, interesting. I just learned through the links that while he was working on normalizing ties to the east, he worked at the same time on anticommunist policies, which is also interesting. If I get what you're saying correctly then this reminds me of when the plan for Fiber optic development in Germany was sacked to create copper to indoctrinate people with cable TV. It was in the same time frame actually. https://netzpolitik.org/2018/danke-helmut-kohl-kabelfernsehen-statt-glasfaserausbau/ https://netzpolitik.org/2018/danke-helmut-kohl-kabelfernsehe...

radu_floricica 2y ago
He's probably suggesting it was an indirect political move in a power struggle, so we should not take it as gospel that Austrians chose to end nuclear. The way, for example, democrats postponed the covid vaccine for about a month to win the elections, or the republicans are currently helping russia. (I'm just trying to explain the concept, I have absolutely no idea about Austrian politics. Other than the commonly known fact that they're currently not energy independent)
- cenamus 2y ago
  Unfortunately, as if we didn't have the best facilities for pumped hydro storage in all of Europe. But the Russian gas money is just too sweet
TomK32 2y ago
It was only in 1991 the Sozialistische Partei Österreichs changed it's name to Sozialdemokratische Partei Österreichs.
t312227 2y ago
hello, ok ... lmgtfu ... so lets go for the details - sadly most of it is in german public vote on zwentendorf ~ where you can read the details i mentioned - and more: * https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volksabstimmung_in_%C3%96sterreich_%C3%BCber_die_Inbetriebnahme_des_Kernkraftwerkes_Zwentendorf https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volksabstimmung_in_%C3%96sterr... an overview about the reforms of the kreisky government during the 70ties * http://kreisky100.at/meilensteine/index.html http://kreisky100.at/meilensteine/index.html or about the person "bruno kreisky" * https://kontrast.at/bruno-kreisky-biografie/ https://kontrast.at/bruno-kreisky-biografie/ very essential for the people were social and work related reforms, education (hertha firnberg) and women-politics (johanna dohnal) ad johanna dohnal - a really remarkable person, on-off part of austrian governmental politics from the 70ties to the 90ties ... the english wikipedia page is sadly pretty empty: * https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Johanna_Dohnal https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Johanna_Dohnal hertha firnberg - another remarkable women in the austrian politics of the 70ties: in short, she made the (higher) austrian educational system available to people w/o a lot (!) of money (higher education schools and universities, which where very elite prior to her reforms) * https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hertha_Firnberg https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hertha_Firnberg the english wikipedia page about her is better than johanna dohnals, but the german version is still more extensive ... ad parties: the SPOe back in the 70ties was still a socialistic party - i think they already dropped the revolutionary aspect of socialism back then ... * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_Democratic_Party_of_Austria https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_Democratic_Party_of_Aus... the OeVP back then was a "very open to the right", bourgeoise - in its negative connotation - party whose primary "clientel" was - and still is - (very) religious people (christian-catholic), larger companies and rich people. * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Austrian_People%27s_Party https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Austrian_People%27s_Party afaik. it was planned to get the powerplant zwentendorf into operation at a later stage in time, but the famous accident in tschernobyl killed off all those plans by the 2nd half of the 1980ties. which finally led to the building of the powerplant "Duernrohr" * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/D%C3%BCrnrohr_Power_Station https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/D%C3%BCrnrohr_Power_Station yet another 0.02€
- rjzzleep 2y ago
  OK thank you for clarifying, that was very interesting. If the socialist party was renamed to social democrats almost 8 years after this person left office, then the way the Wikipedia article is written is literally rewriting history. Just a point about the socialist label for the many Americans here. Willie Brandt worked hard on what was called social market economy, it is actually what gave rise to the successes of the German state in the past. While it is socialist, it is very far away from what the average American likes to call socialist. It was a hugely successful economic model, and the bit by bit destruction of that system is what gave rise to this dysfunctional rump state, which is the current Germany.

radu_floricica 2y ago

He's probably suggesting it was an indirect political move in a power struggle, so we should not take it as gospel that Austrians chose to end nuclear. The way, for example, democrats postponed the covid vaccine for about a month to win the elections, or the republicans are currently helping russia. (I'm just trying to explain the concept, I have absolutely no idea about Austrian politics. Other than the commonly known fact that they're currently not energy independent)

cenamus 2y ago
Unfortunately, as if we didn't have the best facilities for pumped hydro storage in all of Europe. But the Russian gas money is just too sweet

TomK32 2y ago

It was only in 1991 the Sozialistische Partei Österreichs changed it's name to Sozialdemokratische Partei Österreichs.

t312227 2y ago

hello, ok ... lmgtfu ... so lets go for the details - sadly most of it is in german public vote on zwentendorf ~ where you can read the details i mentioned - and more: * https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volksabstimmung_in_%C3%96sterreich_%C3%BCber_die_Inbetriebnahme_des_Kernkraftwerkes_Zwentendorf https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volksabstimmung_in_%C3%96sterr... an overview about the reforms of the kreisky government during the 70ties * http://kreisky100.at/meilensteine/index.html http://kreisky100.at/meilensteine/index.html or about the person "bruno kreisky" * https://kontrast.at/bruno-kreisky-biografie/ https://kontrast.at/bruno-kreisky-biografie/ very essential for the people were social and work related reforms, education (hertha firnberg) and women-politics (johanna dohnal) ad johanna dohnal - a really remarkable person, on-off part of austrian governmental politics from the 70ties to the 90ties ... the english wikipedia page is sadly pretty empty: * https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Johanna_Dohnal https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Johanna_Dohnal hertha firnberg - another remarkable women in the austrian politics of the 70ties: in short, she made the (higher) austrian educational system available to people w/o a lot (!) of money (higher education schools and universities, which where very elite prior to her reforms) * https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hertha_Firnberg https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hertha_Firnberg the english wikipedia page about her is better than johanna dohnals, but the german version is still more extensive ... ad parties: the SPOe back in the 70ties was still a socialistic party - i think they already dropped the revolutionary aspect of socialism back then ... * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_Democratic_Party_of_Austria https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_Democratic_Party_of_Aus... the OeVP back then was a "very open to the right", bourgeoise - in its negative connotation - party whose primary "clientel" was - and still is - (very) religious people (christian-catholic), larger companies and rich people. * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Austrian_People%27s_Party https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Austrian_People%27s_Party afaik. it was planned to get the powerplant zwentendorf into operation at a later stage in time, but the famous accident in tschernobyl killed off all those plans by the 2nd half of the 1980ties. which finally led to the building of the powerplant "Duernrohr" * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/D%C3%BCrnrohr_Power_Station https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/D%C3%BCrnrohr_Power_Station yet another 0.02€

rjzzleep 2y ago
OK thank you for clarifying, that was very interesting. If the socialist party was renamed to social democrats almost 8 years after this person left office, then the way the Wikipedia article is written is literally rewriting history. Just a point about the socialist label for the many Americans here. Willie Brandt worked hard on what was called social market economy, it is actually what gave rise to the successes of the German state in the past. While it is socialist, it is very far away from what the average American likes to call socialist. It was a hugely successful economic model, and the bit by bit destruction of that system is what gave rise to this dysfunctional rump state, which is the current Germany.