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I find LLMs to be useful tools for brainstorming. I have often inadvertently found myself brainstorming just by explaining something challenging I am working o

I find LLMs to be useful tools for brainstorming. I have often inadvertently found myself brainstorming just by explaining something challenging I am working on to a colleague with no expertise in my area. Just explaining forces new perspectives and new ideas. Similarly, LLMs are captive audiences for throwing out ideas and playing with them. The interaction creates something more than just talking to myself or a whiteboard. Not all brainstorming partners need to be first order contributors to have a very positive impact. Different kinds of interactions can spark entirely different kinds of ideas.

jasonjmcghee 2y ago
I agree with this, but also get so irritated with the endless praise. Like, tell me I'm wrong and tell me why. If I present a bad idea, tell me that. Or even like "huh? explain" Looking forward to ramping up the honesty parameter. Hoping OpenAI's new voice model trivializes this so I don't need to prompt engineer.
- fassssst 2y ago
  Curious what happens if you set custom instructions to correct that. Does it work?
- pr337h4m 2y ago
  A simple "Be brutally honest" at the end works surprisingly well.
- vundercind 2y ago
  Me: “I’d like to start a business harvesting cat shit to fight global warming. People would pay me to take their cat shit and bury it because maybe it has carbon in it or something IDK I’m not a scientist. I would give them carbon credits in the form of a cat-shit-sequestration crypto token my business created. I’d pick up the cat shit by bicycle to save carbon emissions. Please help me develop a business plan.” Chargpt: “that’s a great idea for a business! Here are some suggestions…” Not a real exchange, but god, it does feel that way sometimes. One reason you can’t trust the damn thing is it’s too positive.
  - satvikpendem 2y ago
    I just used your prompt on GPT 4o appended with "Be brutally honest, if the idea is bad, feel free to let me know without any sugarcoating" as sibling comments have suggested, and it works pretty well and doesn't give false platitudes.
    - vundercind 2y ago
      Nice, will start using that. … it is still a little weird that the default is, like, psychotic levels of positivity, though.
      - satvikpendem 2y ago
        The creators of these LLMs train it not to offend, to an extreme degree, so much so that it sounds unnatural to humans.
  - kedean 2y ago
    Tried putting that verbatim into Phind, got back an essay on how to get funding to start a business. In the conclusion was this gem: "While the idea of harvesting cat feces for carbon sequestration is innovative, success will depend on thorough research, strategic planning, and effective execution."
  - richardw 2y ago
    I imagine the first models that trained on HN comments resulted in staff members resigning and becoming hermit alcoholics after some brainstorming and "Show HN" test runs. To make something that didn't result in instant and persistent despair likely meant a lot of sentiment analysis on input data, and the result is a system that is extremely pleased every time we show up.
- hobobaggins 2y ago
  That's a truly innovative approach! This will create a robust solution to that problem.
trueismywork 2y ago
That's not brainstorming, that's rubber ducking.
- Grimblewald 2y ago
  No, its better. The reason is the LLM will say or add things you wouldnt have said or added on your own. Wether right or wrong, what it adds, it adds novel input to your thought stream and helps prevent you getting stuck. Ive found myself surprised from time to time with questions an LLM asked, or the justifications provided when pushing for a different path. If you've never talked with a highly opinionated LLM, I understand your scepticism, but there is certainly value if you use the right models creatively.
  - Nevermark 2y ago
    Exactly. Continually asking the LLM to create exhaustive lists of responses to new ideas (big or small) as they first appear, remaining apropos to the running context, is wonderful. Only one unexpected connection out of 20 or 50 is fantastic, when you can iterate quickly. Brainstorming is the tradeoff of accepting lots of "failure" ideas, in order to generate more serendipitous and creative ideas. As I use it, the LLM accelerates, augments, and documents my brainstorming session. -- For some reason, I find it easy to push LLMs to be helpful in ways other people often say "LLMs can't do that". It is just a matter of setting up the right context, being the right guide, and iterating. They are often faster, aware of more concepts, and more versatile (in terms of fulfilling roles), than any single human. Their biggest weakness is having a short context. With some work, multiple sessions can mitigate that. Like getting help on a problem from a series of people, where you have to communicate the progression of context to each. The second weakness is their default to conventional responses. But that is easily overcome by iterative/patient pushing for more creativity responses. Within a session, you can see the model transitioning to more creative as originality goes up, and it gets increasingly "emotionally excited". They start having "fun", and get more adventurous, as epiphanies emerging from either of you go up. This is not just a funny artifact of how we behave, but also a great barometer for achieving LLM "creative mode".
deleted 2y ago
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jasonjmcghee 2y ago

I agree with this, but also get so irritated with the endless praise. Like, tell me I'm wrong and tell me why. If I present a bad idea, tell me that. Or even like "huh? explain" Looking forward to ramping up the honesty parameter. Hoping OpenAI's new voice model trivializes this so I don't need to prompt engineer.

fassssst 2y ago
Curious what happens if you set custom instructions to correct that. Does it work?
pr337h4m 2y ago
A simple "Be brutally honest" at the end works surprisingly well.
vundercind 2y ago
Me: “I’d like to start a business harvesting cat shit to fight global warming. People would pay me to take their cat shit and bury it because maybe it has carbon in it or something IDK I’m not a scientist. I would give them carbon credits in the form of a cat-shit-sequestration crypto token my business created. I’d pick up the cat shit by bicycle to save carbon emissions. Please help me develop a business plan.” Chargpt: “that’s a great idea for a business! Here are some suggestions…” Not a real exchange, but god, it does feel that way sometimes. One reason you can’t trust the damn thing is it’s too positive.
- satvikpendem 2y ago
  I just used your prompt on GPT 4o appended with "Be brutally honest, if the idea is bad, feel free to let me know without any sugarcoating" as sibling comments have suggested, and it works pretty well and doesn't give false platitudes.
  - vundercind 2y ago
    Nice, will start using that. … it is still a little weird that the default is, like, psychotic levels of positivity, though.
    - satvikpendem 2y ago
      The creators of these LLMs train it not to offend, to an extreme degree, so much so that it sounds unnatural to humans.
- kedean 2y ago
  Tried putting that verbatim into Phind, got back an essay on how to get funding to start a business. In the conclusion was this gem: "While the idea of harvesting cat feces for carbon sequestration is innovative, success will depend on thorough research, strategic planning, and effective execution."
- richardw 2y ago
  I imagine the first models that trained on HN comments resulted in staff members resigning and becoming hermit alcoholics after some brainstorming and "Show HN" test runs. To make something that didn't result in instant and persistent despair likely meant a lot of sentiment analysis on input data, and the result is a system that is extremely pleased every time we show up.
hobobaggins 2y ago
That's a truly innovative approach! This will create a robust solution to that problem.

trueismywork 2y ago

That's not brainstorming, that's rubber ducking.

Grimblewald 2y ago
No, its better. The reason is the LLM will say or add things you wouldnt have said or added on your own. Wether right or wrong, what it adds, it adds novel input to your thought stream and helps prevent you getting stuck. Ive found myself surprised from time to time with questions an LLM asked, or the justifications provided when pushing for a different path. If you've never talked with a highly opinionated LLM, I understand your scepticism, but there is certainly value if you use the right models creatively.
- Nevermark 2y ago
  Exactly. Continually asking the LLM to create exhaustive lists of responses to new ideas (big or small) as they first appear, remaining apropos to the running context, is wonderful. Only one unexpected connection out of 20 or 50 is fantastic, when you can iterate quickly. Brainstorming is the tradeoff of accepting lots of "failure" ideas, in order to generate more serendipitous and creative ideas. As I use it, the LLM accelerates, augments, and documents my brainstorming session. -- For some reason, I find it easy to push LLMs to be helpful in ways other people often say "LLMs can't do that". It is just a matter of setting up the right context, being the right guide, and iterating. They are often faster, aware of more concepts, and more versatile (in terms of fulfilling roles), than any single human. Their biggest weakness is having a short context. With some work, multiple sessions can mitigate that. Like getting help on a problem from a series of people, where you have to communicate the progression of context to each. The second weakness is their default to conventional responses. But that is easily overcome by iterative/patient pushing for more creativity responses. Within a session, you can see the model transitioning to more creative as originality goes up, and it gets increasingly "emotionally excited". They start having "fun", and get more adventurous, as epiphanies emerging from either of you go up. This is not just a funny artifact of how we behave, but also a great barometer for achieving LLM "creative mode".

deleted 2y ago

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