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I'm loving this absolutely breathless parroting of "AGI in the next 5 years" and yet: we don't even know what general intelligence is. We don't know how/why/whe

I'm loving this absolutely breathless parroting of "AGI in the next 5 years" and yet: we don't even know what general intelligence is. We don't know how/why/where consciousness arises. It's not even a clearly defined concept. But here we have "Workaccount2" prophesizing the rise of general intelligence :D Please enlighten us sensei, what is actually General Intelligence, and how will you know it's here? I realize my reply is a bit flippant, but it's tiring to see how certain are people about something that nobody truly understands.

Workaccount2 2y ago
Ironically I often post the exact same sentiment that you are sharing. But you are conflating two different things. AGI doesn't require consciousness. We likely will have no idea whether or not the first AGI computer is conscious or not. What we will know though, is that it is solving novel problems that humans struggle with, and from the outside the only way to discern it isn't another human is because it is way to smart to be one. I strongly suspect that the first computers which actually are conscious (AGI or not), whenever that happens, will have to fight a heavy uphill battle to prove it. And there will always be a group of people who will never believe an AI (is it even artificial at that point?) is conscious.
- short_sells_poo 2y ago
  I didn't say that AGI requires consciousness, just that we don't understand what intelligence truly is, along with consciousness (which appears to be a form of intelligence). And I'm not particularly keen of the reasoning: "it is solving novel problems that humans struggle with", because a pocket calculator can solve problems that humans struggle with. A computer can play chess better than a human can, does it mean it's an AGI?
  - Workaccount2 2y ago
    Wikipedia has an entire article for helping to understand what "AGI" refers to: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Artificial_general_intelligence https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Artificial_general_intelligenc...
trashtester 2y ago
AGI has nothing to do with consciousness, unless consciousness is for some reason required to attain it (which doesn't seem like it's the case). AGI simply means that we can create a type of machine that can do any kind of mental task that a human can, at least at a human level.
- short_sells_poo 2y ago
  Consciousness appears to be a form of intelligence. Is it required for general intelligence (whatever that means)? We don't know. Would humans be classified as having general intelligence if we weren't conscious? In any case, I perhaps worded that poorly. I wasn't saying that consciousness is the same as intelligence, it was just an example of how little we actually understand intelligence. > AGI simply means that we can create a type of machine that can do any kind of mental task that a human can, at least at a human level. What does this even mean? What is human level? The ability to write a symphony? Or the ability to calculate 2+2=4? These are such poorly defined metrics that I don't understand how can we then start throwing around very precise (and short!) timelines for attaining it. The statement: "we'll send a human mission to Mars in the next 5 years" is 10x more believable than this breathless AGI hype, because at least the former is well defined.
  - trashtester 2y ago
    > I wasn't saying that consciousness is the same as intelligence, it was just an example of how little we actually understand intelligence. I would say that current AI's do have a kind of intelligence. It's just not generic enough that we label it AGI. Add an ability to form, optimize an execute plans while also increasing the physical world model, and we're getting really close. Both of these abilities are already being developed.

Workaccount2 2y ago

Ironically I often post the exact same sentiment that you are sharing. But you are conflating two different things. AGI doesn't require consciousness. We likely will have no idea whether or not the first AGI computer is conscious or not. What we will know though, is that it is solving novel problems that humans struggle with, and from the outside the only way to discern it isn't another human is because it is way to smart to be one. I strongly suspect that the first computers which actually are conscious (AGI or not), whenever that happens, will have to fight a heavy uphill battle to prove it. And there will always be a group of people who will never believe an AI (is it even artificial at that point?) is conscious.

short_sells_poo 2y ago
I didn't say that AGI requires consciousness, just that we don't understand what intelligence truly is, along with consciousness (which appears to be a form of intelligence). And I'm not particularly keen of the reasoning: "it is solving novel problems that humans struggle with", because a pocket calculator can solve problems that humans struggle with. A computer can play chess better than a human can, does it mean it's an AGI?
- Workaccount2 2y ago
  Wikipedia has an entire article for helping to understand what "AGI" refers to: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Artificial_general_intelligence https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Artificial_general_intelligenc...

trashtester 2y ago

AGI has nothing to do with consciousness, unless consciousness is for some reason required to attain it (which doesn't seem like it's the case). AGI simply means that we can create a type of machine that can do any kind of mental task that a human can, at least at a human level.

short_sells_poo 2y ago
Consciousness appears to be a form of intelligence. Is it required for general intelligence (whatever that means)? We don't know. Would humans be classified as having general intelligence if we weren't conscious? In any case, I perhaps worded that poorly. I wasn't saying that consciousness is the same as intelligence, it was just an example of how little we actually understand intelligence. > AGI simply means that we can create a type of machine that can do any kind of mental task that a human can, at least at a human level. What does this even mean? What is human level? The ability to write a symphony? Or the ability to calculate 2+2=4? These are such poorly defined metrics that I don't understand how can we then start throwing around very precise (and short!) timelines for attaining it. The statement: "we'll send a human mission to Mars in the next 5 years" is 10x more believable than this breathless AGI hype, because at least the former is well defined.
- trashtester 2y ago
  > I wasn't saying that consciousness is the same as intelligence, it was just an example of how little we actually understand intelligence. I would say that current AI's do have a kind of intelligence. It's just not generic enough that we label it AGI. Add an ability to form, optimize an execute plans while also increasing the physical world model, and we're getting really close. Both of these abilities are already being developed.