4 ms·

You don’t know their personal circumstances. Maybe they’re in the same situation as you (I’m assuming “generally in good health”), but they are just more anxiou

by adw 2y ago

You don’t know their personal circumstances. Maybe they’re in the same situation as you (I’m assuming “generally in good health”), but they are just more anxious than you and you believe that’s unnecessary. On the other hand, some people - yes, in your workplace - are likely immunocompromised or caring for someone who is; disease risk is not evenly distributed and COVID did make this set of risks meaningfully and continuously worse. You can’t tell the difference just by looking at someone.

wannacboatmovie 2y ago
The problem I've had with this argument is immunocompromised individuals existed before COVID but masking and obsessive testing was nearly nonexistent outside the elderly and infirm. Now that things have largely reverted back to normal, why have behaviors not followed? You make valid points but COVID broke people's brains and caused widespread hypochondria. People in this category are likely making poorer long term health choices (e.g. N95 masks should not be worn for more than a few hours as it's hard on your heart).
- sunshowers 2y ago
  > The problem I've had with this argument is immunocompromised individuals existed before COVID but masking and obsessive testing was nearly nonexistent outside the elderly and infirm. Now that things have largely reverted back to normal, why have behaviors not followed? My general hope from society is that we learn new things and improve over time. COVID completely changed the public and expert understanding of airborne illnesses. While cloth masks don't work, N95-grade masks absolutely do.
- adw 2y ago
  "Obsessive" is pretty loaded language! Also: normal has shifted, as it always does, so you should expect permanent changes in behavior. It used to be normal to smoke indoors; one of the few good outcomes of Covid is that people are a lot more serious about building ventilation than they used to be, thankfully. Anyway, the new normal _still_ includes Covid, and Covid is still a significant risk to the naive (un-or-insufficiently vaccinated or people who haven't had it yet). It's comparably risky to a bad flu, which is a pretty real thing. Do you have a citation for the N95 risk? I'm sure a bunch of painters and woodworkers would be interested in that.
  - wannacboatmovie 2y ago
    State of California says max of 8 hours. I assume this is over a 24 hour period. https://www.cdph.ca.gov/Programs/EPO/Pages/Wildfire%20Pages/N95-Respirators-FAQs.aspx https://www.cdph.ca.gov/Programs/EPO/Pages/Wildfire%20Pages/... The site also says: N95 respirators may make breathing more difficult and lead to increased breathing and heart rates. Individuals with heart and respiratory conditions should check with their doctor before wearing an N95 respirator. N95 usage results in significantly elevated CO2 levels, reduced O2, and increased heart rate, with far more pronounced effects in overweight individuals. This is common knowledge and there have been plenty of medical articles published about this for years pre-COVID; Google them if you wish. If anyone has done drywall or woodworking you know what a relief it is when you pull that mask off. I am a strong believer in PPE. Wearing it when it's not necessary isn't a great idea.
    - dragonwriter 2y ago
      > State of California says max of 8 hours. I assume this is over a 24 hour period. From the page you point to about use for protection against wildfire smoke, it sounds like it is 8 hours use for a single mask, after which the mask should be discarded and replaced. > N95 usage results in significantly elevated CO2 levels, reduced O2, and increased heart rate, with far more pronounced effects in overweight individuals. In healthcare workers, only in heart rate, not CO2 or O2 [0]; the other factors may occur in the normal environment for non-medical N95 use (outside of the COVID pandemic) – i.e., dealing with particularly particulate-polluted environments, where the particulates will accumulated on the outside of the respirator (outside of the unique circumstances of the pandemic, healthcare N95 use has historically been either for a single encounter or perhaps a period – rarely more than a couple hours – in a diagnosis-segregated environment, since otherwise it would create an exposure risk more than protecting against it.) [0] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8705067/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8705067/
    - meatmanek 2y ago
      > N95 respirators should be worn for a maximum of eight hours and should be replaced regularly. I interpret this as a statement about the lifespan of a respirator, not about what's healthy for the wearer.
- plorkyeran 2y ago
  Perhaps they discovered that wearing a mask wasn’t a particularly big deal for them and they don’t see a reason to stop. If I had the choice between wearing a mask in the office and getting one cold per year I would seriously consider the mask.

by adw 2y ago

wannacboatmovie 2y ago

The problem I've had with this argument is immunocompromised individuals existed before COVID but masking and obsessive testing was nearly nonexistent outside the elderly and infirm. Now that things have largely reverted back to normal, why have behaviors not followed? You make valid points but COVID broke people's brains and caused widespread hypochondria. People in this category are likely making poorer long term health choices (e.g. N95 masks should not be worn for more than a few hours as it's hard on your heart).

sunshowers 2y ago
> The problem I've had with this argument is immunocompromised individuals existed before COVID but masking and obsessive testing was nearly nonexistent outside the elderly and infirm. Now that things have largely reverted back to normal, why have behaviors not followed? My general hope from society is that we learn new things and improve over time. COVID completely changed the public and expert understanding of airborne illnesses. While cloth masks don't work, N95-grade masks absolutely do.
adw 2y ago
"Obsessive" is pretty loaded language! Also: normal has shifted, as it always does, so you should expect permanent changes in behavior. It used to be normal to smoke indoors; one of the few good outcomes of Covid is that people are a lot more serious about building ventilation than they used to be, thankfully. Anyway, the new normal _still_ includes Covid, and Covid is still a significant risk to the naive (un-or-insufficiently vaccinated or people who haven't had it yet). It's comparably risky to a bad flu, which is a pretty real thing. Do you have a citation for the N95 risk? I'm sure a bunch of painters and woodworkers would be interested in that.
- wannacboatmovie 2y ago
  State of California says max of 8 hours. I assume this is over a 24 hour period. https://www.cdph.ca.gov/Programs/EPO/Pages/Wildfire%20Pages/N95-Respirators-FAQs.aspx https://www.cdph.ca.gov/Programs/EPO/Pages/Wildfire%20Pages/... The site also says: N95 respirators may make breathing more difficult and lead to increased breathing and heart rates. Individuals with heart and respiratory conditions should check with their doctor before wearing an N95 respirator. N95 usage results in significantly elevated CO2 levels, reduced O2, and increased heart rate, with far more pronounced effects in overweight individuals. This is common knowledge and there have been plenty of medical articles published about this for years pre-COVID; Google them if you wish. If anyone has done drywall or woodworking you know what a relief it is when you pull that mask off. I am a strong believer in PPE. Wearing it when it's not necessary isn't a great idea.
  - dragonwriter 2y ago
    > State of California says max of 8 hours. I assume this is over a 24 hour period. From the page you point to about use for protection against wildfire smoke, it sounds like it is 8 hours use for a single mask, after which the mask should be discarded and replaced. > N95 usage results in significantly elevated CO2 levels, reduced O2, and increased heart rate, with far more pronounced effects in overweight individuals. In healthcare workers, only in heart rate, not CO2 or O2 [0]; the other factors may occur in the normal environment for non-medical N95 use (outside of the COVID pandemic) – i.e., dealing with particularly particulate-polluted environments, where the particulates will accumulated on the outside of the respirator (outside of the unique circumstances of the pandemic, healthcare N95 use has historically been either for a single encounter or perhaps a period – rarely more than a couple hours – in a diagnosis-segregated environment, since otherwise it would create an exposure risk more than protecting against it.) [0] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8705067/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8705067/
  - meatmanek 2y ago
    > N95 respirators should be worn for a maximum of eight hours and should be replaced regularly. I interpret this as a statement about the lifespan of a respirator, not about what's healthy for the wearer.
plorkyeran 2y ago
Perhaps they discovered that wearing a mask wasn’t a particularly big deal for them and they don’t see a reason to stop. If I had the choice between wearing a mask in the office and getting one cold per year I would seriously consider the mask.