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> I joined the internet myself on IRC and NEWS And email, right? You do have email, don't you? Which is not implemented over the WWW, and is pre-WWW by the bes

> I joined the internet myself on IRC and NEWS And email, right? You do have email, don't you? Which is not implemented over the WWW, and is pre-WWW by the best part of a decade. (RFC 821/822 are dated August 1982, and the first publicly documented version of HTTP 0.9 is, I think, 1991?) I think it's pretty safe to say "The Internet", without any other qualification, came into being with the publication of the IPv4 RFC 791 in September 1981, by Vint Cerf and Robert Kahn. Now, California might not be entirely accurate, as while a fair amount of the work on the Internet Protocols was done at UCLA and UC Berkley, MIT was also heavily involved along with co-ordination from DARPA's IPTO in Virginia (specifically, The Pentagon). But I think "California" is a much more accurate birthplace for The Internet than CERN. Edit: I'm guessing you also use the not-built-on-WWW DNS system from RFCs 882/883 published in 1983?

e40 2y ago
Don’t forget BBN. The TCP/IP code in BSD was originally from them. Let’s call it a prototype.
- p_l 2y ago
  BBN got a lot of the initial work, as well as built the initial infrastructure including routers. BSD got a contract to port TCP/IP to Unix because DoD found themselves facing that the main system they worked with TCP/IP on was discontinued. Thus a grant to port the stack to Unix and make it available as wide as possible.
  - e40 2y ago
    I was on mobile and didn't want to type this out: I was there when Bill Joy, Sam Leffler, and Bob Henry (not Robert R Henry) were crowed around a huge HP terminal in the common area of the 5th floor of Evans Hall. I used the public/common terminals for my work and was sitting there one day when the trio walked in a were excitedly talking about the TCP/IP code from BBN. I have no idea what they were doing, but I think they were trying to build it.
    - p_l 2y ago
      Generally a lot of networking code evolved on the big 36bit machines. There were implementations for unix that predated BSD sockets, but AFAIK Berkeley got a grant to make an implementation that would be freely accessible when TOPS-20 future was indicated to be in jeopardy - or it might have been just because before AT&T being able to demand licensing fees, everyone was putting out clones of Unix on various hardware.
      - e40 2y ago
        I'm pretty sure Berkeley (or UC?) had a System V license and was allowed to redistribute code based on it in BSD. That became a point of contention later, when the *BSDs started to become popular. This is all very old stuff so I might have the details wrong. It was definitely a fun time to be at UCB. I remember getting the early Sun workstations and porting stuff to them. It was a really good port of BSD, but that Motorola chip was a problem for some things. I ported the Franz Lisp compiler (liszt) to it.
KingOfCoders 2y ago
I can't speak about 1981 or 1983, I came to the internet ~1990. I just learned coding in 1981 and wrote some games in 1983 I guess. Funny fact, I didn't have email - or at least didn't use it a lot outside university, cross organisations. I mostly used Usenet/NEWS to interact with people outside our university. This was Germany ~1990 and there were no domains yet in common use. Emails used a complicated addressing scheme and it was unclear how to reach people or find emails (there was no WWW to check a website for an email). You might find them in signature of Usenet posts if at all. "DNS system" Same here, e.g. for FTP we used a text file with IP addresses of FTP servers (for downloading Linux and Aminet stuff) Not sure this was specific to Germany, but the domain name system really came around with the WWW. I even wrote the code that took owning a domain in Germany (I worked at an ISP) from $1000/year (if I remember correctly, wished I had bought Schmidt.de when it was available, even with the price tag) to $1/month with email (the company was called Strato and wanted to launch cheap web+domain+email, the idea was to auto create web+email config from an Oracle database instead of manual configuring servers) for the masses.

e40 2y ago

Don’t forget BBN. The TCP/IP code in BSD was originally from them. Let’s call it a prototype.

p_l 2y ago
BBN got a lot of the initial work, as well as built the initial infrastructure including routers. BSD got a contract to port TCP/IP to Unix because DoD found themselves facing that the main system they worked with TCP/IP on was discontinued. Thus a grant to port the stack to Unix and make it available as wide as possible.
- e40 2y ago
  I was on mobile and didn't want to type this out: I was there when Bill Joy, Sam Leffler, and Bob Henry (not Robert R Henry) were crowed around a huge HP terminal in the common area of the 5th floor of Evans Hall. I used the public/common terminals for my work and was sitting there one day when the trio walked in a were excitedly talking about the TCP/IP code from BBN. I have no idea what they were doing, but I think they were trying to build it.
  - p_l 2y ago
    Generally a lot of networking code evolved on the big 36bit machines. There were implementations for unix that predated BSD sockets, but AFAIK Berkeley got a grant to make an implementation that would be freely accessible when TOPS-20 future was indicated to be in jeopardy - or it might have been just because before AT&T being able to demand licensing fees, everyone was putting out clones of Unix on various hardware.
    - e40 2y ago
      I'm pretty sure Berkeley (or UC?) had a System V license and was allowed to redistribute code based on it in BSD. That became a point of contention later, when the *BSDs started to become popular. This is all very old stuff so I might have the details wrong. It was definitely a fun time to be at UCB. I remember getting the early Sun workstations and porting stuff to them. It was a really good port of BSD, but that Motorola chip was a problem for some things. I ported the Franz Lisp compiler (liszt) to it.

KingOfCoders 2y ago

I can't speak about 1981 or 1983, I came to the internet ~1990. I just learned coding in 1981 and wrote some games in 1983 I guess. Funny fact, I didn't have email - or at least didn't use it a lot outside university, cross organisations. I mostly used Usenet/NEWS to interact with people outside our university. This was Germany ~1990 and there were no domains yet in common use. Emails used a complicated addressing scheme and it was unclear how to reach people or find emails (there was no WWW to check a website for an email). You might find them in signature of Usenet posts if at all. "DNS system" Same here, e.g. for FTP we used a text file with IP addresses of FTP servers (for downloading Linux and Aminet stuff) Not sure this was specific to Germany, but the domain name system really came around with the WWW. I even wrote the code that took owning a domain in Germany (I worked at an ISP) from $1000/year (if I remember correctly, wished I had bought Schmidt.de when it was available, even with the price tag) to $1/month with email (the company was called Strato and wanted to launch cheap web+domain+email, the idea was to auto create web+email config from an Oracle database instead of manual configuring servers) for the masses.