6 ms·

Hey, thanks for the compliment! Glad you've enjoyed Elvish. Re job control - you can run a background job with &, and there are fg and bg commands, but you can

by xiaq 2y ago

Hey, thanks for the compliment! Glad you've enjoyed Elvish. Re job control - you can run a background job with &, and there are fg and bg commands, but you can't actually ^Z a running program (which is what most people mean by job control). I've heard people have success with https://github.com/yshui/job-security https://github.com/yshui/job-security though. Re Elvish and Nushell, I'd add my biased recommendation for Elvish because it has comprehensive reference documents (https://elv.sh/ref/ https://elv.sh/ref/) :)

sidkshatriya 2y ago
The documentation of Elvish is indeed top notch. I also like the self contained nature of the project. Elvish is like a beautiful tool in your arsenal while nushell is a powerful but perhaps too feature-full scripting language. An imperfect analogy: Elvish is like a compact OCaml while nushell is more like a Haskell or C++ of the scripting world !
mst 2y ago
I'm afraid I really need ^Z, %-, %3 and %foo for interactive use. See e.g. the top-right xterm in https://trout.me.uk/screenshot3.jpg https://trout.me.uk/screenshot3.jpg for why. Tried to switch to a ksh for a while and ran face first into that, though OpenBSD ksh has added it so I may attempt that one at some point. (tabs don't fit my brain nearly as well and https://github.com/n-t-roff/heirloom-ex-vi https://github.com/n-t-roff/heirloom-ex-vi is my usual editor and doesn't provide anything of that ilk anyway ... I may be an outlier ...) The syntax and semantics seem really rather nice though, I may attempt elvish for scripting at some point.
- tambourine_man 2y ago
  Traditional Vi? I thought I was hardcore. Certainly an outlier, in a good way :)
  - mst 2y ago
    If I'm on somebody else's system and need to hit the ground running Right Now then this comes into play instead - https://trout.me.uk/X11/vimrc https://trout.me.uk/X11/vimrc (I think it's been a few years now since I've been annoyed enough by something in vim to figure out how to turn it off and add yet another line to that ;)
    - nocman 2y ago
      Out of curiosity, why bother to unmap the cursor keys? I don't ever use them in vim either, but is there something that is prevented from working with having them mapped in vim?
      - baobun 2y ago
        It can be useful to crush old habits. Also very useful if you do a lot of context switching or are an occasional user, to make sure your brain and fingers are in "vim mode" (at least one other line in the file makes this rather obvious) And once it's there, why bother removing it? I think you are in minority if you actively prune your vimrc for dead config...
        mst 2y ago
        I never had those habits, though I have passed that stanza on to people who were just learning to help remind them to use hjkl. I just tend to turn off things I only ever hit by accent (see also the :h override).
      - mst 2y ago
        Because I don't ever hit them except by accident while using vi(m) so disabling means an accidental keypress does nothing rather than something I didn't want. (my main reason for preferring original ex-vi is that when I typo a command, it beeps at me, whereas in vim the typo is usually some completely unrelated but valid command sequence and then WTF JUST HAPPENED and argh)
- xiaq 2y ago
  I have a ton of respect for whoever sticks to the traditional vi! Not promising anything but this may have bumped the priority of supporting ^Z slightly in my TODO list :)
  - mst 2y ago
    Also useful for jumping back and forth between e.g. multiple repl sessions (the re.pl on the top left is a readline frontend wired up over a socket to an p3rl.org/Eval::WithLexicals instance running inside the server I was debugging there). Being able to do e.g. %Task to resume the lib/.../Task.pm editor is -really- nice once you have that many editors open, though I try and stick to about 5 per xterm normally so %- %+ %<digit> would absolutely be enough to get started with.
- ramses0 2y ago
  Clever w.r.t. "job control as task-switcher". The absurdity of that statement being clever kindof stares you in the face a bit, huh? Don't forget ^T for SIGINFO: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Signal_(IPC)#Sending_signals https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Signal_(IPC)#Sending_signals

by xiaq 2y ago

sidkshatriya 2y ago

The documentation of Elvish is indeed top notch. I also like the self contained nature of the project. Elvish is like a beautiful tool in your arsenal while nushell is a powerful but perhaps too feature-full scripting language. An imperfect analogy: Elvish is like a compact OCaml while nushell is more like a Haskell or C++ of the scripting world !

mst 2y ago

I'm afraid I really need ^Z, %-, %3 and %foo for interactive use. See e.g. the top-right xterm in https://trout.me.uk/screenshot3.jpg https://trout.me.uk/screenshot3.jpg for why. Tried to switch to a ksh for a while and ran face first into that, though OpenBSD ksh has added it so I may attempt that one at some point. (tabs don't fit my brain nearly as well and https://github.com/n-t-roff/heirloom-ex-vi https://github.com/n-t-roff/heirloom-ex-vi is my usual editor and doesn't provide anything of that ilk anyway ... I may be an outlier ...) The syntax and semantics seem really rather nice though, I may attempt elvish for scripting at some point.

tambourine_man 2y ago
Traditional Vi? I thought I was hardcore. Certainly an outlier, in a good way :)
- mst 2y ago
  If I'm on somebody else's system and need to hit the ground running Right Now then this comes into play instead - https://trout.me.uk/X11/vimrc https://trout.me.uk/X11/vimrc (I think it's been a few years now since I've been annoyed enough by something in vim to figure out how to turn it off and add yet another line to that ;)
  - nocman 2y ago
    Out of curiosity, why bother to unmap the cursor keys? I don't ever use them in vim either, but is there something that is prevented from working with having them mapped in vim?
    - baobun 2y ago
      It can be useful to crush old habits. Also very useful if you do a lot of context switching or are an occasional user, to make sure your brain and fingers are in "vim mode" (at least one other line in the file makes this rather obvious) And once it's there, why bother removing it? I think you are in minority if you actively prune your vimrc for dead config...
      - mst 2y ago
        I never had those habits, though I have passed that stanza on to people who were just learning to help remind them to use hjkl. I just tend to turn off things I only ever hit by accent (see also the :h override).
    - mst 2y ago
      Because I don't ever hit them except by accident while using vi(m) so disabling means an accidental keypress does nothing rather than something I didn't want. (my main reason for preferring original ex-vi is that when I typo a command, it beeps at me, whereas in vim the typo is usually some completely unrelated but valid command sequence and then WTF JUST HAPPENED and argh)
xiaq 2y ago
I have a ton of respect for whoever sticks to the traditional vi! Not promising anything but this may have bumped the priority of supporting ^Z slightly in my TODO list :)
- mst 2y ago
  Also useful for jumping back and forth between e.g. multiple repl sessions (the re.pl on the top left is a readline frontend wired up over a socket to an p3rl.org/Eval::WithLexicals instance running inside the server I was debugging there). Being able to do e.g. %Task to resume the lib/.../Task.pm editor is -really- nice once you have that many editors open, though I try and stick to about 5 per xterm normally so %- %+ %<digit> would absolutely be enough to get started with.
ramses0 2y ago
Clever w.r.t. "job control as task-switcher". The absurdity of that statement being clever kindof stares you in the face a bit, huh? Don't forget ^T for SIGINFO: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Signal_(IPC)#Sending_signals https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Signal_(IPC)#Sending_signals