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Whilst it feels strange initially and I caught myself thinking why? Most car reverse cameras for 360 degree cameras provide very good visibility outside of the

Whilst it feels strange initially and I caught myself thinking why? Most car reverse cameras for 360 degree cameras provide very good visibility outside of the rear of the car. I don't necessarily see the problem with having a rear windscreen, but that's up to the buyer

troupo 2y ago
Apart from dirt, rain, snow, sleet, dust... mechanical and electrical failures, software errors...
- erulabs 2y ago
  Recessed with hydrophobic cover, heater element, mechanical redundancy (or better, zero moving parts), electronic redundancy, and software testing. Solved! These are all entire industries that already power society-vital functions. Embrace it!
  - kpmcc 2y ago
    So much complexity to do the same thing as a mirror and a window…
    - bonton89 2y ago
      And 10 years from now when it fails it will be a $1200 repair.
    - erulabs 2y ago
      Sure - but as the article points out there are safety and efficiency wins by removing the rear window. Anyways if it’s a terrible decision I’m sure the reviews will point that out. My point was just that the Luddite “computers are bad” argument is silly when all modern cars and planes and everything else is fly-by-wire. If computers fail, the world fails - good thing engineering isn’t just a faf and reliability engineering actually works!
- dzhiurgis 2y ago
  It’s a mirror, not a a steering wheel (which has been hybrid-electronic well over a decade and purely electronic since cybertruck)
  - troupo 2y ago
    It's not a mirror. They are replacing it with a camera. Which, as any vehicle camera ever, will be susceptible to everything described.
discordance 2y ago
Aside from regulation, I've had a few (rare) occurences in a Tesla where it's lagged or a camera has glitched out for a few seconds. Those few seconds could be critical on a road at speed.
- dzhiurgis 2y ago
  Strange mental leap. Are you speeding in reverse?
  - drdaeman 2y ago
    If someone (a kid, or a pet) suddenly appears right behind you, a single second could be crucial, even if you are backing at 1 mph.
    - deleted 2y ago
      [deleted]
    - ahahahahah 2y ago
      A single second is a very long time, typical reaction time is like a tenth of that. Especially at 1 mph. Not only is that a very long time, at 1mph, you are moving less than 2 feet per second. At that speed, your only worry is really a kid diving immediately under your tires.
      - drdaeman 2y ago
        Accidents happen. Kids aren't always smart, observant and logical, pets - doubly so. And even the smartest (but very unlucky) adult can just stumble and land down right under your tires. Quite improbable - for sure, but not exactly impossible.
  - tired-turtle 2y ago
    Consider the case where you are driving slowly and you notice a car speeding at your rear with what appears to be no intention of stopping. A mirror allows you to quickly judge the velocity of the other vehicle so you can consider moving out of its way to avoid a collision. There’s too much lag and uncertainty with a rear-view camera.
citrin_ru 2y ago
On cars I did drive a rear view camera allows to stop exactly were you want but gives a poor situation awareness. Also the wider camera angle the smaller are objects on a screen - there is no such problem when you can turn your head around to see with your eyes.
paradox460 2y ago
My recent model Subaru Ascent came with a "smart mirror". When enabled, the rear view mirror is actually a display, showing a view of what a rear camera, mounted high in the rear window, sees. This is not the backup camera, it's got one of those too, down by the license plate. At first I had a little bit of skepticism. I figured it would be useful when the back is full of cargo or whatever, but limited beyond that. A year on and I scarcely use the "real" mirror. The image on the camera is brighter at night, has less obstruction of the cars pillars and such, and it's automatic gain control reduces the amount of blinding a big truck behind me can cause
- troupo 2y ago
  How do you deal with grime, dirt, rain, snow? The rear view cameras on cars I've driven are often useless even in parking scenarios because of that.
  - sidewndr46 2y ago
    Or 6 years from now when the camera fails and is no longer a part available from the manufacturer
    - mrguyorama 2y ago
      This is actually not an issue. Nearly every single car manufacturer uses the exact same camera module, and have for like a decade now. The standard is that head units have a composite video input that simply gets switched to whenever you put it into reverse, and any overlays are done in the head unit. These are utterly standard parts, and the entire auto industry could die tomorrow and you would still have zero problem sourcing this part for decades to come. It doesn't matter which make or model of car you have.
      - paradox460 2y ago
        They're so ubiquitous, and tiny, that they've started to see common use in the model rail community

troupo 2y ago

Apart from dirt, rain, snow, sleet, dust... mechanical and electrical failures, software errors...

erulabs 2y ago
Recessed with hydrophobic cover, heater element, mechanical redundancy (or better, zero moving parts), electronic redundancy, and software testing. Solved! These are all entire industries that already power society-vital functions. Embrace it!
- kpmcc 2y ago
  So much complexity to do the same thing as a mirror and a window…
  - bonton89 2y ago
    And 10 years from now when it fails it will be a $1200 repair.
  - erulabs 2y ago
    Sure - but as the article points out there are safety and efficiency wins by removing the rear window. Anyways if it’s a terrible decision I’m sure the reviews will point that out. My point was just that the Luddite “computers are bad” argument is silly when all modern cars and planes and everything else is fly-by-wire. If computers fail, the world fails - good thing engineering isn’t just a faf and reliability engineering actually works!
dzhiurgis 2y ago
It’s a mirror, not a a steering wheel (which has been hybrid-electronic well over a decade and purely electronic since cybertruck)
- troupo 2y ago
  It's not a mirror. They are replacing it with a camera. Which, as any vehicle camera ever, will be susceptible to everything described.

discordance 2y ago

Aside from regulation, I've had a few (rare) occurences in a Tesla where it's lagged or a camera has glitched out for a few seconds. Those few seconds could be critical on a road at speed.

dzhiurgis 2y ago
Strange mental leap. Are you speeding in reverse?
- drdaeman 2y ago
  If someone (a kid, or a pet) suddenly appears right behind you, a single second could be crucial, even if you are backing at 1 mph.
  - deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
  - ahahahahah 2y ago
    A single second is a very long time, typical reaction time is like a tenth of that. Especially at 1 mph. Not only is that a very long time, at 1mph, you are moving less than 2 feet per second. At that speed, your only worry is really a kid diving immediately under your tires.
    - drdaeman 2y ago
      Accidents happen. Kids aren't always smart, observant and logical, pets - doubly so. And even the smartest (but very unlucky) adult can just stumble and land down right under your tires. Quite improbable - for sure, but not exactly impossible.
- tired-turtle 2y ago
  Consider the case where you are driving slowly and you notice a car speeding at your rear with what appears to be no intention of stopping. A mirror allows you to quickly judge the velocity of the other vehicle so you can consider moving out of its way to avoid a collision. There’s too much lag and uncertainty with a rear-view camera.

citrin_ru 2y ago

On cars I did drive a rear view camera allows to stop exactly were you want but gives a poor situation awareness. Also the wider camera angle the smaller are objects on a screen - there is no such problem when you can turn your head around to see with your eyes.

paradox460 2y ago

My recent model Subaru Ascent came with a "smart mirror". When enabled, the rear view mirror is actually a display, showing a view of what a rear camera, mounted high in the rear window, sees. This is not the backup camera, it's got one of those too, down by the license plate. At first I had a little bit of skepticism. I figured it would be useful when the back is full of cargo or whatever, but limited beyond that. A year on and I scarcely use the "real" mirror. The image on the camera is brighter at night, has less obstruction of the cars pillars and such, and it's automatic gain control reduces the amount of blinding a big truck behind me can cause

troupo 2y ago
How do you deal with grime, dirt, rain, snow? The rear view cameras on cars I've driven are often useless even in parking scenarios because of that.
- sidewndr46 2y ago
  Or 6 years from now when the camera fails and is no longer a part available from the manufacturer
  - mrguyorama 2y ago
    This is actually not an issue. Nearly every single car manufacturer uses the exact same camera module, and have for like a decade now. The standard is that head units have a composite video input that simply gets switched to whenever you put it into reverse, and any overlays are done in the head unit. These are utterly standard parts, and the entire auto industry could die tomorrow and you would still have zero problem sourcing this part for decades to come. It doesn't matter which make or model of car you have.
    - paradox460 2y ago
      They're so ubiquitous, and tiny, that they've started to see common use in the model rail community