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So you're saying a conscious Universe could still be Newton's "clockwork universe"? Well, Einstein did say "God does not play dice with the universe" but I thi

So you're saying a conscious Universe could still be Newton's "clockwork universe"? Well, Einstein did say "God does not play dice with the universe" but I think the quantum direction is where the riddle of consciousness may be be found. The beauty and terror of our own minds is the uncertainty that lies in the choices we make and the outcomes we get from those choices.

int_19h 2y ago
I don't think quantum mechanics fundamentally changes things, either. If you look at it from the Copenhagen perspective, sure, you get randomness, but I don't think many people would seriously argue that adding a true RNG to an otherwise mechanical contraption makes it any less mechanical, even if it becomes unpredictable - the real question behind "free will" is not whether branching is deterministic, but rather whether the entity has any degree of control over it. And if you look at it from the many-worlds perspective, then you just have parallelized determinism. My personal take on this is that the question itself is meaningless because we cannot define "free will" in any coherent way that is actually testable. It all boils down to defining what "conscious" and "self" mean, which are themselves very fuzzy concepts that elude clear definitions. My solution to all this is to just stop wasting time on it, since I don't think there are any practical implications to it (and if there's no free will - whatever that means in practice - then my opinion is itself predetermined in any case).
- labrador 2y ago
  I agree with you that the question of free will is a waste of time, which is why I generally avoid it. Maybe if you are a student of Catholic Church doctrine and have a final exam coming up? Sapolsky does not write from a Catholic perspective, but his audience might have been brought up with it so his writings might be provocative for them and thus profitable for him. I've been watching his career with more amusement than irritation. He is classic case of a regular guy becoming an "influencer." The same thing happened to Jordan Peterson. At the same time [2015] I found Sapolsky's lecture on depression I found Peterson's. Both not well known at the time. Both lectures really helpful. Both now well known influencers.

int_19h 2y ago

I don't think quantum mechanics fundamentally changes things, either. If you look at it from the Copenhagen perspective, sure, you get randomness, but I don't think many people would seriously argue that adding a true RNG to an otherwise mechanical contraption makes it any less mechanical, even if it becomes unpredictable - the real question behind "free will" is not whether branching is deterministic, but rather whether the entity has any degree of control over it. And if you look at it from the many-worlds perspective, then you just have parallelized determinism. My personal take on this is that the question itself is meaningless because we cannot define "free will" in any coherent way that is actually testable. It all boils down to defining what "conscious" and "self" mean, which are themselves very fuzzy concepts that elude clear definitions. My solution to all this is to just stop wasting time on it, since I don't think there are any practical implications to it (and if there's no free will - whatever that means in practice - then my opinion is itself predetermined in any case).

labrador 2y ago
I agree with you that the question of free will is a waste of time, which is why I generally avoid it. Maybe if you are a student of Catholic Church doctrine and have a final exam coming up? Sapolsky does not write from a Catholic perspective, but his audience might have been brought up with it so his writings might be provocative for them and thus profitable for him. I've been watching his career with more amusement than irritation. He is classic case of a regular guy becoming an "influencer." The same thing happened to Jordan Peterson. At the same time [2015] I found Sapolsky's lecture on depression I found Peterson's. Both not well known at the time. Both lectures really helpful. Both now well known influencers.