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Maybe in your dreams. Few counter points: - Austria-Hungaria was a multi ethnic, multi religious, multinational entity - Similar Holy Roman Empire before - H
by morbicer 2y ago
Maybe in your dreams. Few counter points:
- Austria-Hungaria was a multi ethnic, multi religious, multinational entity
- Similar Holy Roman Empire before
- House of Habsburgs at some point ruled parts of middle Europe, some Netherlands and Spain
- Spain is a multi-national state till today, with strong tensions
- Germany was for a long time only a loose group of small countries
- Denmark ruling other Scandinavian countries
- Religious wars devastated Europe for centuries
- Social cohesion? Ever heard of French Revolution and hundred other uprisings?
- Even though British Isles were not invaded after 1066 they had their fair share of infighting. Ask around Northern Ireland about peaceful religious unity
Ethnostates are very recent occurrence and even then it's not 100%. The shared history is a history of non-stop wars. Europe was rich for all other reasons. Some noble (preserving Greco-Roman legacy, enlightenment, birth of democratic ideas etc), some external (mild climate, resources), some not so noble (exploiting colonies).
- willmadden 2y agoWow, that's an impressive number of goal post moves in a single post. I'm talking about the last 25 years, or at least post industrial revolution. If you want to debate this in a neutral place, I'm happy to do so, but this isn't exactly a level playing field here on hacker news. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AoWibRxD_pY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AoWibRxD_pY
- morbicer 2y agoIgnoring hundreds years of history is moving goalposts. Greetings from a country that almost overnight gained 5% of population from Ukraine (very welcomed by me). Ethnic tensions brought some of Europe's worst atrocities, not prosperity. Even in last 25 years, the Balkans are still sore. Post Industrial Revolution we had two world wars and many revolutions. Does your neutral debating place look like Europe's history?
- Arnt 2y agoYou're pretty good at moving goalposts yourself. What's particular about the last 25 years? I was at a conference this week where someone spoke about deploying software in the German administration. I translate one of his sentences: "If the northern states install Jitsi, the southern states are going to install Big Blue Button out of pure principle." (Germany is a federal state composed of 16 states.)
- seatac76 2y agoPeace in Europe is a bit of an outlier [1]. The period you refer to is also not a good example given Europe’s peace since WW2 has been more a product of American support and might than European identity. I think Europe was far more ethnically homogenous before WW2 and as the link shows rather violent. So your reasoning is just plain wrong. [1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_conflicts_in_Europe https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_conflicts_in_Europe
- CogitoCogito 2y agoI’m pretty sure all Western European countries have been multi-ethnic for the last 25 years. Certainly all I’ve had any experience with (Sweden, Germany, France, UK, maybe more).
- M95D 2y agoYou forgot the Bosnia war.