5 ms·

Only in other countries than the US there are also these interviews and you make far from 400k :)

Paul-Craft 2y ago
Even in the US, "$400k" is almost certainly an outlier and not the typical case. Ever notice how people making these claims never provide data about actual comp distributions? I've been an engineer for almost 10 years and never had an offer come close to $400k per year.
- Domenic_S 2y ago
  It's the typical case for Bay Area-HQ tech companies, at essentially all levels for Tier-1 companies, higher levels at Tier-2/3 companies, and specialist roles beyond that. "software engineering" doesn't print money any more than being "in finance" does, you'll make more or less depending on what company you do it for.
  - pseudalopex 2y ago
    > It's the typical case for Bay Area-HQ tech companies, at essentially all levels for Tier-1 companies, higher levels at Tier-2/3 companies What are the tiers? It's close to typical for a Bay Area Google L5 according to levels.fyi.
    - whimsicalism 2y ago
      tiers are about the quality of the company, not the internal leveling. Google would be a tier1-2, Uber/Lyft/Netflix would be tier 1, Adobe would be tier 2-3, etc.
      - pseudalopex 2y ago
        The point was companies usually considered tier 1 like Google did not have such compensation. What makes Lyft higher quality than Google?
- humansareok1 2y ago
  Do you work in California for a company in this list? Meta Amazon Google Netflix Airbnb Stripe Square Microsoft If not it's unsurprising. But these actually are typical offers at those companies including Base Salary + Stock + Bonus.
- tracker1 2y ago
  It probably depends. I know at a very senior level in a lot of companies, you can hit a base salary around half that for Staff/Principal positions and some Architect roles, especially in higher paying areas. The value of stock offerings and other compensation, bonuses etc will vary a lot though. You may grind out 5-10 years to reach that level, then 5 years to fully vest at half that pay to see a $1M stock payout at 5 years bringing the average to $400k. Who knows. Different arrangements work differently. As an aside, when the market is relatively good, don't be afraid to straight up ask where compensation is on given roles when recruiters reach out, or to ask for more than you think you might get. You're pretty unlikely to get $400k or anywhere near it as a base... but you'd be surprised how reachable say $150k+ is as a base salary for a remote position when you aren't in SF or another major/expensive city.
- ryandrake 2y ago
  Everyone on HN knows someone whose brother's uncle's girlfriend's nephew's former roommate works at Facebook and made $400K as a developer. And they'll point to that one person and say "See, it is possible to make $400K in tech." Yes, it is technically possible, just like it's possible to do plenty of difficult things. That doesn't make these salaries common. For every 1 person making $400K-800K at FAANG in the Bay Area, how many dozens are working outside the Bay Area and/or for some no-name company making $120K?
  - deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
  - varjag 2y ago
    I dunno man. A good third of my class seems to be working at FAANG and we're all from an unremarkable university in Eastern Europe. I'd imagine the prospects are much better if you start in the States already.
    - pseudalopex 2y ago
      The official estimate of software developer positions in the United States was 1,656,880 in 2023.[1] 10% of that would be a high estimate of FAANG software developers in all countries. And most in those companies make less. [1] https://www.bls.gov/oes/current/oes151252.htm https://www.bls.gov/oes/current/oes151252.htm
      - varjag 2y ago
        A high estimate? Google alone stands at 180k employees. I'd imagine at least a half of those are technical positions.
        pseudalopex 2y ago
        Technical positions is more than software engineers. 60,000 software engineers was the most I saw. And most other technical positions pay less.
- whimsicalism 2y ago
  in the sfba, levels.fyi shows it roughly at 85%-ile, not everyone - but hardly extreme outlier
  - Paul-Craft 2y ago
    I wonder what it is after accounting for self reporting bias.
    - cwalv 2y ago
      The numbers are real. I was in a similar incredulous position 4-5 years ago. Hiring is still relatively weak, but you can always try to get an offer yourself. Or even just talk to and ask recruiters; they have no reason to lie. You don't have to take your cousin's girlfriend's uncle's word for it.
    - whimsicalism 2y ago
      probably significantly lower, but still not all that rare. i make roughly that much as do most people i know in sf
  - vundercind 2y ago
    A giant proportion of developers have no idea wtf “levels.fyi” is and are quietly writing Java or some shit in some suburban office park in a city you wouldn’t ever bother to visit, for $80k-160k/yr.

Even in the US, "$400k" is almost certainly an outlier and not the typical case. Ever notice how people making these claims never provide data about actual comp distributions? I've been an engineer for almost 10 years and never had an offer come close to $400k per year.

Domenic_S 2y ago
It's the typical case for Bay Area-HQ tech companies, at essentially all levels for Tier-1 companies, higher levels at Tier-2/3 companies, and specialist roles beyond that. "software engineering" doesn't print money any more than being "in finance" does, you'll make more or less depending on what company you do it for.
- pseudalopex 2y ago
  > It's the typical case for Bay Area-HQ tech companies, at essentially all levels for Tier-1 companies, higher levels at Tier-2/3 companies What are the tiers? It's close to typical for a Bay Area Google L5 according to levels.fyi.
  - whimsicalism 2y ago
    tiers are about the quality of the company, not the internal leveling. Google would be a tier1-2, Uber/Lyft/Netflix would be tier 1, Adobe would be tier 2-3, etc.
    - pseudalopex 2y ago
      The point was companies usually considered tier 1 like Google did not have such compensation. What makes Lyft higher quality than Google?
humansareok1 2y ago
Do you work in California for a company in this list? Meta Amazon Google Netflix Airbnb Stripe Square Microsoft If not it's unsurprising. But these actually are typical offers at those companies including Base Salary + Stock + Bonus.
tracker1 2y ago
It probably depends. I know at a very senior level in a lot of companies, you can hit a base salary around half that for Staff/Principal positions and some Architect roles, especially in higher paying areas. The value of stock offerings and other compensation, bonuses etc will vary a lot though. You may grind out 5-10 years to reach that level, then 5 years to fully vest at half that pay to see a $1M stock payout at 5 years bringing the average to $400k. Who knows. Different arrangements work differently. As an aside, when the market is relatively good, don't be afraid to straight up ask where compensation is on given roles when recruiters reach out, or to ask for more than you think you might get. You're pretty unlikely to get $400k or anywhere near it as a base... but you'd be surprised how reachable say $150k+ is as a base salary for a remote position when you aren't in SF or another major/expensive city.
ryandrake 2y ago
Everyone on HN knows someone whose brother's uncle's girlfriend's nephew's former roommate works at Facebook and made $400K as a developer. And they'll point to that one person and say "See, it is possible to make $400K in tech." Yes, it is technically possible, just like it's possible to do plenty of difficult things. That doesn't make these salaries common. For every 1 person making $400K-800K at FAANG in the Bay Area, how many dozens are working outside the Bay Area and/or for some no-name company making $120K?
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
- varjag 2y ago
  I dunno man. A good third of my class seems to be working at FAANG and we're all from an unremarkable university in Eastern Europe. I'd imagine the prospects are much better if you start in the States already.
  - pseudalopex 2y ago
    The official estimate of software developer positions in the United States was 1,656,880 in 2023.[1] 10% of that would be a high estimate of FAANG software developers in all countries. And most in those companies make less. [1] https://www.bls.gov/oes/current/oes151252.htm https://www.bls.gov/oes/current/oes151252.htm
    - varjag 2y ago
      A high estimate? Google alone stands at 180k employees. I'd imagine at least a half of those are technical positions.
      - pseudalopex 2y ago
        Technical positions is more than software engineers. 60,000 software engineers was the most I saw. And most other technical positions pay less.
whimsicalism 2y ago
in the sfba, levels.fyi shows it roughly at 85%-ile, not everyone - but hardly extreme outlier
- Paul-Craft 2y ago
  I wonder what it is after accounting for self reporting bias.
  - cwalv 2y ago
    The numbers are real. I was in a similar incredulous position 4-5 years ago. Hiring is still relatively weak, but you can always try to get an offer yourself. Or even just talk to and ask recruiters; they have no reason to lie. You don't have to take your cousin's girlfriend's uncle's word for it.
  - whimsicalism 2y ago
    probably significantly lower, but still not all that rare. i make roughly that much as do most people i know in sf
- vundercind 2y ago
  A giant proportion of developers have no idea wtf “levels.fyi” is and are quietly writing Java or some shit in some suburban office park in a city you wouldn’t ever bother to visit, for $80k-160k/yr.