4 ms·

I've often wondered if our complete demonization of all smoking was a bit of a disservice to the sporadic smoke that likely helped with managing one's weight wh

by eej71 2y ago

I've often wondered if our complete demonization of all smoking was a bit of a disservice to the sporadic smoke that likely helped with managing one's weight which has its own health benefits.

lenerdenator 2y ago
The problem came from the fact that sporadic smoking didn't serve the profits of tobacco companies in the way they would have liked. The shoving of high-fructose corn syrup and other calorie-rich ingredients into everything sold in the US to increase consumption (again, for profits) has a much greater impact on weight management, though.
- itsoktocry 2y ago
  >The shoving of high-fructose corn syrup and other calorie-rich ingredients into everything sold in the US to increase consumption (again, for profits) Do you have any evidence of this conspiracy? Perhaps it's just food producers adding an abundant, cheap sweetener to their crap because that's what the market demands? Read the ingredients and buy or don't buy. People need to have a bit of personal accountability in these things.
  - redserk 2y ago
    Where are you finding many options in products without HFCS or additives? Even the much-higher-end supermarkets near me don't have meaningful alternatives for a lot of products where I am, and I'm in a HCOL area.
    - bombcar 2y ago
      I've not yet been unable to find something without corn syrup (I don't feel that "high fructose" or not changes how much of a filler it is), but it can be a pain in the ass to read the ingredients on everything on the shelf. If I were FDA dictator for a day, I'd requite a corn logo on anything with corn syrup, and crossed corn for anything with HFCS. Now calorie inflation can be done with sugar, too - the real deal is to have things that aren't "diabetes inducing sweet".
    - astura 2y ago
      What sort of products are you looking for? I read the ingredients on everything (I'm a vegetarian) and I don't buy anything with corn syrup or added sugar that isn't either 1) a once-in-a-while treat or 2) something I'd add a bit of sweetener to if I were to make it myself. I don't shop anywhere special.
  - mrybczyn 2y ago
    LOL "the market demands". Sure, and Opium was also demanded by the market, should we just add it to all food items?
    - slibhb 2y ago
      No we shouldn't. But we also shouldn't pretend that demand for opium is manufactured by evil people. There's high demand for opium because it makes people feel really good. The same thing is true for junk food. People eat it because it tastes good. How much food should be regulated is up for debate but there's something irritating about this reflex to blame every problem on some shadowy cabal of rich people.
  - shermantanktop 2y ago
    Better yet, buy the ingredients and make your own. Most food is not hard to make from scratch, tastes better, and is healthier because you see what goes into it and can choose to moderate elements. But it takes a little time and a bit of care.
    - lenerdenator 2y ago
      The time is the rub. If you're stuck in traffic for time measured in hours, you're not baking fresh bread during the week.
  - lenerdenator 2y ago
    I'm not saying it's a conspiracy. I'm saying it's fact. Humans like sweet foods because with the exception of felids, pretty much every species on the planet gains a survival advantage by consuming as many calories as possible when eating. This means that our brains feel rewarded when we eat sugary foods, and rewarded behavior is repeated behavior. That wasn't a problem when such foods were rare but now that they're available pretty much anywhere on-demand, yeah, it's a problem. Personal accountability can only go so far when you're shown ads for sugary cereals and candy every morning as a kid. Contrast that with, say, the current marijuana market in my region. It's regulated, it's only available at a relatively high price from licensed dispensaries. There are billboards but not much in the way of TV or radio ads. It's not marketed to kids. If you get addicted to marijuana in the Lower Midwestern US, that's a lack of personal accountability because you can't point to all of the stuff that's used to make junk food popular and say "they got me addicted!".
- slibhb 2y ago
  > The shoving of high-fructose corn syrup and other calorie-rich ingredients into everything sold in the US to increase consumption (again, for profits) has a much greater impact on weight management, though. It doesn't have to be some conspiracy to make people addicted to calories. People are (relatively) rich, food is cheap, and eating feels good.
  - leononame 2y ago
    I think my GP isn't suggesting that it's a conspiracy at all. Just that sugar is in almost every where you can put it even if it doesn't need it just to hook you on sugar a bit more.
  - impossiblefork 2y ago
    If people are genuinely happy they don't start doing things to excess. Eating to excess is usually an attempt to distract oneself from something else, a 'cope'. That only happens in a society that is not rich and happy. If people are actually rich and happy you see them take up expensive sports, golf, tennis, horseback riding. They rarely get fat unless there's something personally wrong with them.
    - rayiner 2y ago
      You’re projecting culturally-determined views about what “rich and happy” people do onto others. Rich people taking up sports and eating in moderation is a WASP thing. It’s much less of a thing in the south. And it’s not a thing at all in say the Indian subcontinent, where it’s unusual for adults to play sports.
      - impossiblefork 2y ago
        I don't think so. Swedes aren't WASPs, but we are this way. I think Spanish people and Germans are too. I agree that it is as you say in India, but surely both Indian-Americans and Asian-American must become a bit this other way, since they'll probably work with many WASPs, and surely they get affected by media and general societal expectations?
- cycomanic 2y ago
  And the ones responsible are the same. Much of the obesity crisis is caused by tobacco companies investing in food and employing the same advertisement and lobbying tactics as before [1]. The penalties were too light, really the behaviour should have resulted in serious jail time and confiscation of all assets. [1] https://www.washingtonpost.com/wellness/2023/09/19/addiction-foods-hyperpalatable-tobacco/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/wellness/2023/09/19/addiction...
EasyMark 2y ago
I highly doubt "the sporadic" smoke helped anyone with weight. More and more sugar and other junk has been dumped into our food to make it tastier than the competition and society has taught us to "just grab something" rather than taking an hour and cooking a meal. We didn't get fat because we smoked less. I'm sure a few did but all evidence points at reduced exercise and more junk stuff into our mouth holes as the culprit.

by eej71 2y ago

I've often wondered if our complete demonization of all smoking was a bit of a disservice to the sporadic smoke that likely helped with managing one's weight which has its own health benefits.

lenerdenator 2y ago

The problem came from the fact that sporadic smoking didn't serve the profits of tobacco companies in the way they would have liked. The shoving of high-fructose corn syrup and other calorie-rich ingredients into everything sold in the US to increase consumption (again, for profits) has a much greater impact on weight management, though.

itsoktocry 2y ago
>The shoving of high-fructose corn syrup and other calorie-rich ingredients into everything sold in the US to increase consumption (again, for profits) Do you have any evidence of this conspiracy? Perhaps it's just food producers adding an abundant, cheap sweetener to their crap because that's what the market demands? Read the ingredients and buy or don't buy. People need to have a bit of personal accountability in these things.
- redserk 2y ago
  Where are you finding many options in products without HFCS or additives? Even the much-higher-end supermarkets near me don't have meaningful alternatives for a lot of products where I am, and I'm in a HCOL area.
  - bombcar 2y ago
    I've not yet been unable to find something without corn syrup (I don't feel that "high fructose" or not changes how much of a filler it is), but it can be a pain in the ass to read the ingredients on everything on the shelf. If I were FDA dictator for a day, I'd requite a corn logo on anything with corn syrup, and crossed corn for anything with HFCS. Now calorie inflation can be done with sugar, too - the real deal is to have things that aren't "diabetes inducing sweet".
  - astura 2y ago
    What sort of products are you looking for? I read the ingredients on everything (I'm a vegetarian) and I don't buy anything with corn syrup or added sugar that isn't either 1) a once-in-a-while treat or 2) something I'd add a bit of sweetener to if I were to make it myself. I don't shop anywhere special.
- mrybczyn 2y ago
  LOL "the market demands". Sure, and Opium was also demanded by the market, should we just add it to all food items?
  - slibhb 2y ago
    No we shouldn't. But we also shouldn't pretend that demand for opium is manufactured by evil people. There's high demand for opium because it makes people feel really good. The same thing is true for junk food. People eat it because it tastes good. How much food should be regulated is up for debate but there's something irritating about this reflex to blame every problem on some shadowy cabal of rich people.
- shermantanktop 2y ago
  Better yet, buy the ingredients and make your own. Most food is not hard to make from scratch, tastes better, and is healthier because you see what goes into it and can choose to moderate elements. But it takes a little time and a bit of care.
  - lenerdenator 2y ago
    The time is the rub. If you're stuck in traffic for time measured in hours, you're not baking fresh bread during the week.
- lenerdenator 2y ago
  I'm not saying it's a conspiracy. I'm saying it's fact. Humans like sweet foods because with the exception of felids, pretty much every species on the planet gains a survival advantage by consuming as many calories as possible when eating. This means that our brains feel rewarded when we eat sugary foods, and rewarded behavior is repeated behavior. That wasn't a problem when such foods were rare but now that they're available pretty much anywhere on-demand, yeah, it's a problem. Personal accountability can only go so far when you're shown ads for sugary cereals and candy every morning as a kid. Contrast that with, say, the current marijuana market in my region. It's regulated, it's only available at a relatively high price from licensed dispensaries. There are billboards but not much in the way of TV or radio ads. It's not marketed to kids. If you get addicted to marijuana in the Lower Midwestern US, that's a lack of personal accountability because you can't point to all of the stuff that's used to make junk food popular and say "they got me addicted!".
slibhb 2y ago
> The shoving of high-fructose corn syrup and other calorie-rich ingredients into everything sold in the US to increase consumption (again, for profits) has a much greater impact on weight management, though. It doesn't have to be some conspiracy to make people addicted to calories. People are (relatively) rich, food is cheap, and eating feels good.
- leononame 2y ago
  I think my GP isn't suggesting that it's a conspiracy at all. Just that sugar is in almost every where you can put it even if it doesn't need it just to hook you on sugar a bit more.
- impossiblefork 2y ago
  If people are genuinely happy they don't start doing things to excess. Eating to excess is usually an attempt to distract oneself from something else, a 'cope'. That only happens in a society that is not rich and happy. If people are actually rich and happy you see them take up expensive sports, golf, tennis, horseback riding. They rarely get fat unless there's something personally wrong with them.
  - rayiner 2y ago
    You’re projecting culturally-determined views about what “rich and happy” people do onto others. Rich people taking up sports and eating in moderation is a WASP thing. It’s much less of a thing in the south. And it’s not a thing at all in say the Indian subcontinent, where it’s unusual for adults to play sports.
    - impossiblefork 2y ago
      I don't think so. Swedes aren't WASPs, but we are this way. I think Spanish people and Germans are too. I agree that it is as you say in India, but surely both Indian-Americans and Asian-American must become a bit this other way, since they'll probably work with many WASPs, and surely they get affected by media and general societal expectations?
cycomanic 2y ago
And the ones responsible are the same. Much of the obesity crisis is caused by tobacco companies investing in food and employing the same advertisement and lobbying tactics as before [1]. The penalties were too light, really the behaviour should have resulted in serious jail time and confiscation of all assets. [1] https://www.washingtonpost.com/wellness/2023/09/19/addiction-foods-hyperpalatable-tobacco/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/wellness/2023/09/19/addiction...

EasyMark 2y ago

I highly doubt "the sporadic" smoke helped anyone with weight. More and more sugar and other junk has been dumped into our food to make it tastier than the competition and society has taught us to "just grab something" rather than taking an hour and cooking a meal. We didn't get fat because we smoked less. I'm sure a few did but all evidence points at reduced exercise and more junk stuff into our mouth holes as the culprit.