4 ms·

Something in the scale of a modern DE could become decrepit, outdated, and difficult to use real quick without major support. There’s more DE’s than I could sh

Something in the scale of a modern DE could become decrepit, outdated, and difficult to use real quick without major support. There’s more DE’s than I could shake a stick at and like 5 of them are usable for a an average user.

rad_gruchalski 2y ago
Well, like it’s just your opinion, man… Opinions are like asses, everyone has their own.
DiggyJohnson 2y ago
As someone that uses the 5th most possible DE I appreciate the state of the landscape. But more to the point I think you’re not framing this correctly. I think this question is the best way to probe get to the heart of our disagreement: How would you coerce or incentivize the developers of this DE to work on a more mature project?
- pipeline_peak 2y ago
  > How would you coerce or incentivize the developers of this DE to work on a more mature project? Being a cog in a wheel is always a sacrifice, but also more successful. It’s more likely to be usable by regular people and overall more likely to be used. The biggest problem with desktop Linux is it’s a fragmentation of unpolished projects, many of which overlapping each other.
  - prmoustache 2y ago
    Do you say the same of all photoshop alternatives or all different AI companies doing the same stuff...or even Apple building their own OS instead of providing their computers with Windows?
  - lelanthran 2y ago
    >> How would you coerce or incentivize the developers of this DE to work on a more mature project? > Being a cog in a wheel is always a sacrifice, but also more successful. It’s more likely to be usable by regular people and overall more likely to be used. > The biggest problem with desktop Linux is it’s a fragmentation of unpolished projects, many of which overlapping each other. Maybe you didn't realise this, but you didn't actually answer the question: exactly how would you convince the people having fun writing their own little project to switch to being an unpaid employee on someone else's project? I want to hear the actual sentence you'd utter to convince someone to give up a hobby and become an unpaid employee. I mean, what could I possibly say to you that would make you give up cycling/TV/reading/art/gaming/$HOBBY and spend that time as an unpaid employee for me?
    - pipeline_peak 2y ago
      When did anyone claim this was a hobbyist project? It looks pretty serious to me.
      - Skeime 2y ago
        "Serious" and "hobbyist" are not antonyms.
        exe34 2y ago
        An important distinction, I'm sure, but entirely beside the point. It's people scratching an itch in their spare time, so we can't expect them to do things the way we want. We can choose to ignore them at best.
        Skeime 2y ago
        That’s what I wanted to say as well. This might look and even be serious, but it’s still someone’s hobby project as well. They can do whatever they want.
      - lelanthran 2y ago
        > When did anyone claim this was a hobbyist project? It looks pretty serious to me. You did, right here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40269321 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40269321 >>>>> Don’t Linux people realize there are a limited number of people to work on these things in their spare time for free? How were you expecting someone to interpret "things in their spare time"? What other meaning did you have in mind for that sentence? Regardless of whether it is a hobby or not, and how that differs from your meaning of "spare time", I still want to know what it is I could say to you that would make you give up your spare time to do unpaid labour for me. In context, I think this is a legitimate question - you've bemoaned the fact of people doing something "in their spare time" instead of being an unpaid employee, so the question "What can *I* say to *you* to make *you* spend *your* spare time being *my* unpaid employee?" still stands If nothing I could possibly say would convince you, that's okay too - just say so, like this "There's nothing you can say to make me your unpaid employee".
  - Intermernet 2y ago
    Have you considered that people do things for fun? They may not care about some abstract concept of "success"? Maybe writing their own DE is exactly the "success" they wanted. Also, being a cog in a wheel does nothing but perpetuate the wheel. If the wheel has a flat tire, or the wheel isn't round, or the wheel is going in the wrong direction, then being a cog provides no benefit to anyone.
  - DiggyJohnson 2y ago
    You completely avoided my question. How would you make, coerce, or incentivize them to work on a different project than the one they created or the one they wanted to work on initially?

rad_gruchalski 2y ago

Well, like it’s just your opinion, man… Opinions are like asses, everyone has their own.

DiggyJohnson 2y ago

As someone that uses the 5th most possible DE I appreciate the state of the landscape. But more to the point I think you’re not framing this correctly. I think this question is the best way to probe get to the heart of our disagreement: How would you coerce or incentivize the developers of this DE to work on a more mature project?

pipeline_peak 2y ago
> How would you coerce or incentivize the developers of this DE to work on a more mature project? Being a cog in a wheel is always a sacrifice, but also more successful. It’s more likely to be usable by regular people and overall more likely to be used. The biggest problem with desktop Linux is it’s a fragmentation of unpolished projects, many of which overlapping each other.
- prmoustache 2y ago
  Do you say the same of all photoshop alternatives or all different AI companies doing the same stuff...or even Apple building their own OS instead of providing their computers with Windows?
- lelanthran 2y ago
  >> How would you coerce or incentivize the developers of this DE to work on a more mature project? > Being a cog in a wheel is always a sacrifice, but also more successful. It’s more likely to be usable by regular people and overall more likely to be used. > The biggest problem with desktop Linux is it’s a fragmentation of unpolished projects, many of which overlapping each other. Maybe you didn't realise this, but you didn't actually answer the question: exactly how would you convince the people having fun writing their own little project to switch to being an unpaid employee on someone else's project? I want to hear the actual sentence you'd utter to convince someone to give up a hobby and become an unpaid employee. I mean, what could I possibly say to you that would make you give up cycling/TV/reading/art/gaming/$HOBBY and spend that time as an unpaid employee for me?
  - pipeline_peak 2y ago
    When did anyone claim this was a hobbyist project? It looks pretty serious to me.
    - Skeime 2y ago
      "Serious" and "hobbyist" are not antonyms.
      - exe34 2y ago
        An important distinction, I'm sure, but entirely beside the point. It's people scratching an itch in their spare time, so we can't expect them to do things the way we want. We can choose to ignore them at best.
        Skeime 2y ago
        That’s what I wanted to say as well. This might look and even be serious, but it’s still someone’s hobby project as well. They can do whatever they want.
    - lelanthran 2y ago
      > When did anyone claim this was a hobbyist project? It looks pretty serious to me. You did, right here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40269321 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40269321 >>>>> Don’t Linux people realize there are a limited number of people to work on these things in their spare time for free? How were you expecting someone to interpret "things in their spare time"? What other meaning did you have in mind for that sentence? Regardless of whether it is a hobby or not, and how that differs from your meaning of "spare time", I still want to know what it is I could say to you that would make you give up your spare time to do unpaid labour for me. In context, I think this is a legitimate question - you've bemoaned the fact of people doing something "in their spare time" instead of being an unpaid employee, so the question "What can *I* say to *you* to make *you* spend *your* spare time being *my* unpaid employee?" still stands If nothing I could possibly say would convince you, that's okay too - just say so, like this "There's nothing you can say to make me your unpaid employee".
- Intermernet 2y ago
  Have you considered that people do things for fun? They may not care about some abstract concept of "success"? Maybe writing their own DE is exactly the "success" they wanted. Also, being a cog in a wheel does nothing but perpetuate the wheel. If the wheel has a flat tire, or the wheel isn't round, or the wheel is going in the wrong direction, then being a cog provides no benefit to anyone.
- DiggyJohnson 2y ago
  You completely avoided my question. How would you make, coerce, or incentivize them to work on a different project than the one they created or the one they wanted to work on initially?