4 ms·

I’m not really sure why a large empty space is needed to build a safer road/sidewalk? Just looking out my front door (suburban DC)… the road is posted 35mm but

I’m not really sure why a large empty space is needed to build a safer road/sidewalk? Just looking out my front door (suburban DC)… the road is posted 35mm but you can “safely” go 50+ because the lanes are wide and relatively straight. But, there are uncontrolled/no-signal entrances to neighborhoods every 1/4 mile or so, so speeds really should be <30mph (IMO). There are very few signaled pedestrians crossings, so if you need to cross, it’s a game of frogged, or walk a mile out of your way to the nearest full intersection. The bike lanes on the road are just painted on, no protection for cars. And on and on. None of this requires more space - just DOT employees who can think beyond getting around in a car. We could easily slow the road by narrowing the lane. We could easily add signalled ped crossings. We could easily make the sidewalks continuous (same grade through intersections instead of road level - the benefit is cars enter “pedestrian space” when crossing instead of the other way around). We could add floppy bollards (not sure what they’re called) to give more separation between cars and bicycles (won’t stop a really bad driver, but will at least stop cars from using the bike lane as yet another car lane).

aldonius 3y ago
> floppy bollards The technical term near me seems to be something like "delineator posts" (or just "orange posts" after the colouring) and I think that's pretty reasonable. As you say, they don't provide any protection against a car or truck, but they do signal where not to be a bit better.
- perilunar 3y ago
  flex posts
  - aldonius 3y ago
    oh yeah, that's it!
arp242 3y ago
A lot of roads in British and European cities are not like that at all; it's not uncommon that they're narrow enough that they're one-way streets because it's wide enough for only one car. I just picked a random location in Bristol: https://www.google.com/maps/@51.4365588,-2.5893081,3a,75y,28.76h,68.48t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sp6kLWBu9CQSPmADA8kKmlw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?entry=ttu https://www.google.com/maps/@51.4365588,-2.5893081,3a,75y,28... – lots of Bristol streets are like that, and lots of streets in other cities are like that. In some places what you're saying does apply, but by and large, it's not like American road design.
- oakesm9 3y ago
  Even that example shows some thought has been put into non-car users. The road itself is one way for car traffic, but two way for bikes. This likely allows a non-main road cut though for bike traffic. The pavement (sidewalk) outside the front of the school is double the width and has bollards along it to stop cars parking on the pavement. This slow massively narrows the road to you’ll likely be driving about 20-30mph regardless of the speed limit. The junction behind the initial street view has a tiny traffic island with a bollard to protect bikes coming the “wrong way” out of the one way road from cars turning into it. Without that cars turning right into it would always cut that corner. Given the space constraints it’s actually a pretty well designed street.
  - arp242 3y ago
    Yeah, overall Bristol isn't too bad – I've lived in worse places. However, many footpaths are very narrow – sometimes not even enough for two people to walk side-by-side – and there just isn't any more space unless you half the parking. That would actually be good eventually IMHO, but is a far larger change than the previous poster was suggesting. In some ways these small narrow roads are better by the way, even for non-cars. Everyone understands the need to share the road. Big roads seem to create a "this is for cars only and everything else doesn't belong here and shouldn't be here" type of mindset.
    - oakesm9 3y ago

aldonius 3y ago

> floppy bollards The technical term near me seems to be something like "delineator posts" (or just "orange posts" after the colouring) and I think that's pretty reasonable. As you say, they don't provide any protection against a car or truck, but they do signal where not to be a bit better.

perilunar 3y ago
flex posts
- aldonius 3y ago
  oh yeah, that's it!

arp242 3y ago

A lot of roads in British and European cities are not like that at all; it's not uncommon that they're narrow enough that they're one-way streets because it's wide enough for only one car. I just picked a random location in Bristol: https://www.google.com/maps/@51.4365588,-2.5893081,3a,75y,28.76h,68.48t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sp6kLWBu9CQSPmADA8kKmlw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?entry=ttu https://www.google.com/maps/@51.4365588,-2.5893081,3a,75y,28... – lots of Bristol streets are like that, and lots of streets in other cities are like that. In some places what you're saying does apply, but by and large, it's not like American road design.

oakesm9 3y ago
Even that example shows some thought has been put into non-car users. The road itself is one way for car traffic, but two way for bikes. This likely allows a non-main road cut though for bike traffic. The pavement (sidewalk) outside the front of the school is double the width and has bollards along it to stop cars parking on the pavement. This slow massively narrows the road to you’ll likely be driving about 20-30mph regardless of the speed limit. The junction behind the initial street view has a tiny traffic island with a bollard to protect bikes coming the “wrong way” out of the one way road from cars turning into it. Without that cars turning right into it would always cut that corner. Given the space constraints it’s actually a pretty well designed street.
- arp242 3y ago
  Yeah, overall Bristol isn't too bad – I've lived in worse places. However, many footpaths are very narrow – sometimes not even enough for two people to walk side-by-side – and there just isn't any more space unless you half the parking. That would actually be good eventually IMHO, but is a far larger change than the previous poster was suggesting. In some ways these small narrow roads are better by the way, even for non-cars. Everyone understands the need to share the road. Big roads seem to create a "this is for cars only and everything else doesn't belong here and shouldn't be here" type of mindset.
  - oakesm9 3y ago