3 ms·

Perhaps the folks working on the project in what is presumably their spare time for free do know this?

bitwize 2y ago
The idea is that it's irresponsible to diffuse the limited amount of effort by launching your own desktop environment project rather than contributing your talents to one of KDE or GNOME. I don't ever see myself using this DE, but the fact that it seems to be one guy's labor of love kind of makes me happy.
- DiggyJohnson 2y ago
  But presumably they aren’t interested in working on a part of a larger project that they have less creative and admin control over. This is a huge deal and precisely the answer to your question.
  - pipeline_peak 2y ago
    Something in the scale of a modern DE could become decrepit, outdated, and difficult to use real quick without major support. There’s more DE’s than I could shake a stick at and like 5 of them are usable for a an average user.
    - rad_gruchalski 2y ago
      Well, like it’s just your opinion, man… Opinions are like asses, everyone has their own.
    - DiggyJohnson 2y ago
      As someone that uses the 5th most possible DE I appreciate the state of the landscape. But more to the point I think you’re not framing this correctly. I think this question is the best way to probe get to the heart of our disagreement: How would you coerce or incentivize the developers of this DE to work on a more mature project?
      - pipeline_peak 2y ago
        > How would you coerce or incentivize the developers of this DE to work on a more mature project? Being a cog in a wheel is always a sacrifice, but also more successful. It’s more likely to be usable by regular people and overall more likely to be used. The biggest problem with desktop Linux is it’s a fragmentation of unpolished projects, many of which overlapping each other.
        prmoustache 2y ago
        Do you say the same of all photoshop alternatives or all different AI companies doing the same stuff...or even Apple building their own OS instead of providing their computers with Windows?
        lelanthran 2y ago
        >> How would you coerce or incentivize the developers of this DE to work on a more mature project? > Being a cog in a wheel is always a sacrifice, but also more successful. It’s more likely to be usable by regular people and overall more likely to be used. > The biggest problem with desktop Linux is it’s a fragmentation of unpolished projects, many of which overlapping each other. Maybe you didn't realise this, but you didn't actually answer the question: exactly how would you convince the people having fun writing their own little project to switch to being an unpaid employee on someone else's project? I want to hear the actual sentence you'd utter to convince someone to give up a hobby and become an unpaid employee. I mean, what could I possibly say to you that would make you give up cycling/TV/reading/art/gaming/$HOBBY and spend that time as an unpaid employee for me?
        pipeline_peak 2y ago
        When did anyone claim this was a hobbyist project? It looks pretty serious to me.
        Skeime 2y ago
        "Serious" and "hobbyist" are not antonyms.
- paiute 2y ago
  I slowed down on linux as KDE slowly degraded. I love that someone is starting something new, maybe it’ll go somewhere.
- jstanley 2y ago
  > The idea is that it's irresponsible to diffuse the limited amount of effort by launching your own desktop environment project rather than contributing your talents to one of KDE or GNOME. This is totally wrong. The free software world is as great as it is precisely because everyone is free to start their own project without asking for permission. And I don't think you meant it this way, but can we please not make people feel irresponsible for pursuing projects they find interesting? That's an easy way to kill a new developer's interest, motivation, and enthusiasm. And they're sure not going to pursue projects they don't find interesting. If you have an idea for a project you want to work on: please go and do it! I don't care if there are already dozens of alternatives. Go forth and create. Maybe you'll make the new best version of the thing, maybe you won't. But you definitely won't if you don't try. And even if your version is no good, if you cultivate a habit of making things you want to make then you'll have the best chances, and at least in the end you'll have lived a life of creation rather than idle consumption.
  - zzo38computer 2y ago
    > If you have an idea for a project you want to work on: please go and do it! I don't care if there are already dozens of alternatives. Go forth and create. Maybe you'll make the new best version of the thing, maybe you won't. But you definitely won't if you don't try. And even if your version is no good, if you cultivate a habit of making things you want to make then you'll have the best chances, and at least in the end you'll have lived a life of creation rather than idle consumption. I agree. Furthermore: It might have some advantages compared with other programs even if it does not have all of the features or other advantages that the other one might have. Also, even if it is no good you or others might improve it later, anyways. There may also be reasons why one user or programmer might prefer to use one program than another, or even someone might use both if they really want to do.
- lelanthran 2y ago
  > The idea is that it's irresponsible to diffuse the limited amount of effort by launching your own desktop environment project rather than contributing your talents to one of KDE or GNOME. That's just a different way for some people to complain that someone, somewhere, is having fun that they don't approve of. > I don't ever see myself using this DE, but the fact that it seems to be one guy's labor of love kind of makes me happy. Yup. I heartily support these kinds of things. I remember how much flack Terry Davis used to get on the internet, but those flamers have long since been forgotten by history while both he and TempleOS have their own Wikipedia entry. I still have "Use TempleOS daily for a month" on my bucket list :-/
  - nutrie 2y ago
    > That's just a different way for some people to complain that someone, somewhere, is having fun that they don't approve of. Yep, it ain't their business, period. It's like talking trash on people who like making pottery.

The idea is that it's irresponsible to diffuse the limited amount of effort by launching your own desktop environment project rather than contributing your talents to one of KDE or GNOME. I don't ever see myself using this DE, but the fact that it seems to be one guy's labor of love kind of makes me happy.

DiggyJohnson 2y ago
But presumably they aren’t interested in working on a part of a larger project that they have less creative and admin control over. This is a huge deal and precisely the answer to your question.
- pipeline_peak 2y ago
  Something in the scale of a modern DE could become decrepit, outdated, and difficult to use real quick without major support. There’s more DE’s than I could shake a stick at and like 5 of them are usable for a an average user.
  - rad_gruchalski 2y ago
    Well, like it’s just your opinion, man… Opinions are like asses, everyone has their own.
  - DiggyJohnson 2y ago
    As someone that uses the 5th most possible DE I appreciate the state of the landscape. But more to the point I think you’re not framing this correctly. I think this question is the best way to probe get to the heart of our disagreement: How would you coerce or incentivize the developers of this DE to work on a more mature project?
    - pipeline_peak 2y ago
      > How would you coerce or incentivize the developers of this DE to work on a more mature project? Being a cog in a wheel is always a sacrifice, but also more successful. It’s more likely to be usable by regular people and overall more likely to be used. The biggest problem with desktop Linux is it’s a fragmentation of unpolished projects, many of which overlapping each other.
      - prmoustache 2y ago
        Do you say the same of all photoshop alternatives or all different AI companies doing the same stuff...or even Apple building their own OS instead of providing their computers with Windows?
      - lelanthran 2y ago
        >> How would you coerce or incentivize the developers of this DE to work on a more mature project? > Being a cog in a wheel is always a sacrifice, but also more successful. It’s more likely to be usable by regular people and overall more likely to be used. > The biggest problem with desktop Linux is it’s a fragmentation of unpolished projects, many of which overlapping each other. Maybe you didn't realise this, but you didn't actually answer the question: exactly how would you convince the people having fun writing their own little project to switch to being an unpaid employee on someone else's project? I want to hear the actual sentence you'd utter to convince someone to give up a hobby and become an unpaid employee. I mean, what could I possibly say to you that would make you give up cycling/TV/reading/art/gaming/$HOBBY and spend that time as an unpaid employee for me?
        pipeline_peak 2y ago
        When did anyone claim this was a hobbyist project? It looks pretty serious to me.
        Skeime 2y ago
        "Serious" and "hobbyist" are not antonyms.
paiute 2y ago
I slowed down on linux as KDE slowly degraded. I love that someone is starting something new, maybe it’ll go somewhere.
jstanley 2y ago
> The idea is that it's irresponsible to diffuse the limited amount of effort by launching your own desktop environment project rather than contributing your talents to one of KDE or GNOME. This is totally wrong. The free software world is as great as it is precisely because everyone is free to start their own project without asking for permission. And I don't think you meant it this way, but can we please not make people feel irresponsible for pursuing projects they find interesting? That's an easy way to kill a new developer's interest, motivation, and enthusiasm. And they're sure not going to pursue projects they don't find interesting. If you have an idea for a project you want to work on: please go and do it! I don't care if there are already dozens of alternatives. Go forth and create. Maybe you'll make the new best version of the thing, maybe you won't. But you definitely won't if you don't try. And even if your version is no good, if you cultivate a habit of making things you want to make then you'll have the best chances, and at least in the end you'll have lived a life of creation rather than idle consumption.
- zzo38computer 2y ago
  > If you have an idea for a project you want to work on: please go and do it! I don't care if there are already dozens of alternatives. Go forth and create. Maybe you'll make the new best version of the thing, maybe you won't. But you definitely won't if you don't try. And even if your version is no good, if you cultivate a habit of making things you want to make then you'll have the best chances, and at least in the end you'll have lived a life of creation rather than idle consumption. I agree. Furthermore: It might have some advantages compared with other programs even if it does not have all of the features or other advantages that the other one might have. Also, even if it is no good you or others might improve it later, anyways. There may also be reasons why one user or programmer might prefer to use one program than another, or even someone might use both if they really want to do.
lelanthran 2y ago
> The idea is that it's irresponsible to diffuse the limited amount of effort by launching your own desktop environment project rather than contributing your talents to one of KDE or GNOME. That's just a different way for some people to complain that someone, somewhere, is having fun that they don't approve of. > I don't ever see myself using this DE, but the fact that it seems to be one guy's labor of love kind of makes me happy. Yup. I heartily support these kinds of things. I remember how much flack Terry Davis used to get on the internet, but those flamers have long since been forgotten by history while both he and TempleOS have their own Wikipedia entry. I still have "Use TempleOS daily for a month" on my bucket list :-/
- nutrie 2y ago
  > That's just a different way for some people to complain that someone, somewhere, is having fun that they don't approve of. Yep, it ain't their business, period. It's like talking trash on people who like making pottery.