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This phenomenon of software engineers using MacBooks for work is a rare and primarily coastal phenomenon, at least in North America. Virtually all software engi

This phenomenon of software engineers using MacBooks for work is a rare and primarily coastal phenomenon, at least in North America. Virtually all software engineering at utility companies, hospitals, state and local governments, and similarly boring but critical enterprise companies in industries like insurance happens on Windows on Azure using Windows or Microsoft oriented stacks.

hsdropout 2y ago
>Windows on Azure Lol, citation needed if you actually believe this. >or Microsoft oriented stacks. is a very complicated way to say Windows desktop.
- vector_spaces 2y ago
  Re windows desktop, no, it's not a complicated way of saying that. I am talking about, for example: - ASP.NET Core backends running on anything (e.g. Linux) - Angular or Vue frontends running on anything - applications using SQL Server databases running on anything - applications targeting on-prem Windows servers or VMs or, sure, Windows desktops - data / reporting systems that interact with AAS
  - hsdropout 2y ago
    Apparently I phrased my response poorly. I was responding to the narrow context of the idea that devs aren't using Azure VMs instead of Macs. I was not disputing the popularity of Azure.
- _cenw 2y ago
  Microsoft sales is surprisingly good at selling Azure to c-level at companies where the primary output isn't software, based on existing Windows/Office deployments. Unfortunately also true for Teams. Retailers are also often opposed to AWS because they consider Amazon a competitor in its entirety.
- mvdtnz 2y ago
  Just so you know this is a very ignorant comment. I don't mean that as an insult, but literally you are ignorant of the facts. If you care you should use this opportunity to educate yourself on the state of the Microsoft stack.
SunlitCat 2y ago
This is something "bothering" me as well. It's either Mac or Linux if you want to be "cool" in tech. I am always like "wait do you not write any Windows software or is it all on the Web"? Maybe I am ignorant and stuff and maybe it's just bothering me. :)
- _cenw 2y ago
  Windows computers tend to also get the most overreaching invasive MDM / Endpoint Slowdown Software.
  - SunlitCat 2y ago
    Can't say for Windows, but at work I manage a bunch of iPads with JAMF and it's really comfy to use.
- oooyay 2y ago
  I write applications for Linux, MacOS, and Windows but I use cross-compiling frameworks like Wails or Tauri to do so. If I write in Windows Forms (old Xamarin forms) then my application only works on Windows. MacOS is similar. All of my development occurs in Linux as a result.
- tikhonj 2y ago
  There's a lot of work that is neither Windows software nor web. And much (most?) of that runs on Linux.
- xur17 2y ago
  I find this whole conversation amusing. Growing up and going to school in the 2000s, Windows was the default choice, and I felt like I had to fight to use anything else. Now the conversation has reversed to some extent.
oooyay 2y ago
I, personally, would not chalk that up to a phenomenon. Operating System selection largely depends on the work you do paired with the industry you're in. Some extrapolations: I work in systems engineering for web technology companies. Most of the applications I build run on Linux so it makes sense to write on a Unix like OS. I could use Linux or MacOS, but Apple has a strong preconfiguration and leasing pipeline so usually the companies I work for offer MacBooks Pros. When I was building software in the US South I would have to look out for companies that were Windows shops because I don't do Windows systems engineering and there were an abundance of shops that did before the .NET Core rewrite that enabled you to run on Linux. Those shops would've definitely shipped me a Windows laptop. Anecdotally, I buy servers out of a DC in Houston and nearly all of them come with Windows Datacenter edition. Most of those companies fell into certain industries that didn't include what I typically worked in. That's all to say, region can be roughly correlated, but it's not the actual reason. It largely has to do with who sold who the software stack they have trouble moving off of today which influences everything else.
- vector_spaces 2y ago
  Note that my comment was observational, I'm not saying companies should use Windows, and I'm not even talking about reasons for using one tech stack or another. I'm just reminding the parent that this association of Windows with "non-technical" is nonsense -- lots of extremely talented folks work on difficult and important problems and critical systems on Windows, targeting Microsoft stacks. Further, it seems likely that most software is written on Windows.
  - oooyay 2y ago
    Yeap, that's all fair. I was mainly poking at your word choice of "phenomenon" because it can be reasoned. I'm not quite sure about your last sentence but that's an entirely different discussion with much more noise than signal to parse through.
    - yen223 2y ago
      "Phenomenon" just means "thing that can be observed". It doesn't need to mean something that is unusual or surprising.

hsdropout 2y ago

>Windows on Azure Lol, citation needed if you actually believe this. >or Microsoft oriented stacks. is a very complicated way to say Windows desktop.

vector_spaces 2y ago
Re windows desktop, no, it's not a complicated way of saying that. I am talking about, for example: - ASP.NET Core backends running on anything (e.g. Linux) - Angular or Vue frontends running on anything - applications using SQL Server databases running on anything - applications targeting on-prem Windows servers or VMs or, sure, Windows desktops - data / reporting systems that interact with AAS
- hsdropout 2y ago
  Apparently I phrased my response poorly. I was responding to the narrow context of the idea that devs aren't using Azure VMs instead of Macs. I was not disputing the popularity of Azure.
_cenw 2y ago
Microsoft sales is surprisingly good at selling Azure to c-level at companies where the primary output isn't software, based on existing Windows/Office deployments. Unfortunately also true for Teams. Retailers are also often opposed to AWS because they consider Amazon a competitor in its entirety.
mvdtnz 2y ago
Just so you know this is a very ignorant comment. I don't mean that as an insult, but literally you are ignorant of the facts. If you care you should use this opportunity to educate yourself on the state of the Microsoft stack.

SunlitCat 2y ago

This is something "bothering" me as well. It's either Mac or Linux if you want to be "cool" in tech. I am always like "wait do you not write any Windows software or is it all on the Web"? Maybe I am ignorant and stuff and maybe it's just bothering me. :)

_cenw 2y ago
Windows computers tend to also get the most overreaching invasive MDM / Endpoint Slowdown Software.
- SunlitCat 2y ago
  Can't say for Windows, but at work I manage a bunch of iPads with JAMF and it's really comfy to use.
oooyay 2y ago
I write applications for Linux, MacOS, and Windows but I use cross-compiling frameworks like Wails or Tauri to do so. If I write in Windows Forms (old Xamarin forms) then my application only works on Windows. MacOS is similar. All of my development occurs in Linux as a result.
tikhonj 2y ago
There's a lot of work that is neither Windows software nor web. And much (most?) of that runs on Linux.
xur17 2y ago
I find this whole conversation amusing. Growing up and going to school in the 2000s, Windows was the default choice, and I felt like I had to fight to use anything else. Now the conversation has reversed to some extent.

oooyay 2y ago

I, personally, would not chalk that up to a phenomenon. Operating System selection largely depends on the work you do paired with the industry you're in. Some extrapolations: I work in systems engineering for web technology companies. Most of the applications I build run on Linux so it makes sense to write on a Unix like OS. I could use Linux or MacOS, but Apple has a strong preconfiguration and leasing pipeline so usually the companies I work for offer MacBooks Pros. When I was building software in the US South I would have to look out for companies that were Windows shops because I don't do Windows systems engineering and there were an abundance of shops that did before the .NET Core rewrite that enabled you to run on Linux. Those shops would've definitely shipped me a Windows laptop. Anecdotally, I buy servers out of a DC in Houston and nearly all of them come with Windows Datacenter edition. Most of those companies fell into certain industries that didn't include what I typically worked in. That's all to say, region can be roughly correlated, but it's not the actual reason. It largely has to do with who sold who the software stack they have trouble moving off of today which influences everything else.

vector_spaces 2y ago
Note that my comment was observational, I'm not saying companies should use Windows, and I'm not even talking about reasons for using one tech stack or another. I'm just reminding the parent that this association of Windows with "non-technical" is nonsense -- lots of extremely talented folks work on difficult and important problems and critical systems on Windows, targeting Microsoft stacks. Further, it seems likely that most software is written on Windows.
- oooyay 2y ago
  Yeap, that's all fair. I was mainly poking at your word choice of "phenomenon" because it can be reasoned. I'm not quite sure about your last sentence but that's an entirely different discussion with much more noise than signal to parse through.
  - yen223 2y ago
    "Phenomenon" just means "thing that can be observed". It doesn't need to mean something that is unusual or surprising.