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Is there a technical name for the two tiered legal system we have here? The average jack off is never going to get away with destroying evidence, yet the rich,

Is there a technical name for the two tiered legal system we have here? The average jack off is never going to get away with destroying evidence, yet the rich, and corporations are given deference all the time for all sorts of shit.

SOVIETIC-BOSS88 2y ago
A double standard. Sadly present in most communities since the dawn of humanity.
- cess11 2y ago
  Are you sure about that?
mcmoor 2y ago
I've heard the idiom of "knive policy", sharp at the bottom, dull at the top.
nl 2y ago
I think most people can turn off their chat history too? And indeed having a policy of always turning your chat history off for sensitive conversations is unlikely to be sanctioned unlike in this case. (Google didn't destroy chat logs, they just had history off for them)
- dwaite 2y ago
  You may find the judge isn't willing to entertain a game of semantics. My understanding is it is as simple as the following: Google was ordered to retain information, and afterward specifically changed their policies such that the information would not be retained, and also misled the court that the information was being properly retained.
- ameister14 2y ago
  >(Google didn't destroy chat logs, they just had history off for them) This is a weird argument I'm seeing a lot. Isn't this just a variable trigger for deletion? What is the functional difference in the code, I mean? Using a really, really simple example: If this were stored in a table, I could make a front end button say delete and call that back to the back-end to push the command to delete the cell/row/whatever; I could also set a timer on that with an if/then statement using date of creation and current date and remove the front-end functionality, or have some front-end trigger to turn on the loop to count down the whatever time period, 30 days say. The end result is the same; the command being sent is [delete], not [don't save this]. I guess without the command the default would be that the data was wiped when the power to the machine went out like with a TI-99, is that what you are thinking of?
  - svnt 2y ago
    No, they don’t delete them, they just don’t keep them after 24 hours, and they keep them before that. No deleting. for message in messages: if message.t < 86400 keep(message) else continue // let nature do its thing
    - ameister14 2y ago
      So you're saying it works as a reverse system where the default is not to save the chat? That's interesting, I would have assumed adding a database and writing to that database for storage would by necessity involve sending a command to delete in order to remove it from that storage or having some other action taken to wipe the data periodically. I get it if there is no history at all, but there clearly is here. Where does keep(message) send things? Is that not stored anywhere? Sorry if this is too complicated, I don't know a lot about chat technically so trying to wrap my head around this.
      - svnt 2y ago
        Sorry, that was a joke. They do have to save them somewhere and then delete them. Nature doesn’t help much. Maybe if you use enough non-ECC RAM or something.
        ameister14 2y ago
        haha ok thanks, I was really scratching my head to think about how that would possibly work. I was going back to idea of writing to a file that overwrote itself in sections but it's good to hear that was a joke.
Sakos 2y ago
You have people here defending Google. So, apparently the average jack off is okay with a two tiered system.

SOVIETIC-BOSS88 2y ago

A double standard. Sadly present in most communities since the dawn of humanity.

cess11 2y ago
Are you sure about that?

mcmoor 2y ago

I've heard the idiom of "knive policy", sharp at the bottom, dull at the top.

nl 2y ago

I think most people can turn off their chat history too? And indeed having a policy of always turning your chat history off for sensitive conversations is unlikely to be sanctioned unlike in this case. (Google didn't destroy chat logs, they just had history off for them)

dwaite 2y ago
You may find the judge isn't willing to entertain a game of semantics. My understanding is it is as simple as the following: Google was ordered to retain information, and afterward specifically changed their policies such that the information would not be retained, and also misled the court that the information was being properly retained.
ameister14 2y ago
>(Google didn't destroy chat logs, they just had history off for them) This is a weird argument I'm seeing a lot. Isn't this just a variable trigger for deletion? What is the functional difference in the code, I mean? Using a really, really simple example: If this were stored in a table, I could make a front end button say delete and call that back to the back-end to push the command to delete the cell/row/whatever; I could also set a timer on that with an if/then statement using date of creation and current date and remove the front-end functionality, or have some front-end trigger to turn on the loop to count down the whatever time period, 30 days say. The end result is the same; the command being sent is [delete], not [don't save this]. I guess without the command the default would be that the data was wiped when the power to the machine went out like with a TI-99, is that what you are thinking of?
- svnt 2y ago
  No, they don’t delete them, they just don’t keep them after 24 hours, and they keep them before that. No deleting. for message in messages: if message.t < 86400 keep(message) else continue // let nature do its thing
  - ameister14 2y ago
    So you're saying it works as a reverse system where the default is not to save the chat? That's interesting, I would have assumed adding a database and writing to that database for storage would by necessity involve sending a command to delete in order to remove it from that storage or having some other action taken to wipe the data periodically. I get it if there is no history at all, but there clearly is here. Where does keep(message) send things? Is that not stored anywhere? Sorry if this is too complicated, I don't know a lot about chat technically so trying to wrap my head around this.
    - svnt 2y ago
      Sorry, that was a joke. They do have to save them somewhere and then delete them. Nature doesn’t help much. Maybe if you use enough non-ECC RAM or something.
      - ameister14 2y ago
        haha ok thanks, I was really scratching my head to think about how that would possibly work. I was going back to idea of writing to a file that overwrote itself in sections but it's good to hear that was a joke.

Sakos 2y ago

You have people here defending Google. So, apparently the average jack off is okay with a two tiered system.