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People hate php for no reason. They talk about performance or whatever while building rest crud apps. Literally any language can handle that easily and your bot

People hate php for no reason. They talk about performance or whatever while building rest crud apps. Literally any language can handle that easily and your bottleneck is usually the database. I've scaled startups on PHP to hundreds of thousands of users running on a few cheap ec2 instances. But no one wants to build new php projects instead focusing on Go, Python, or Ruby. I honestly don't get it. PHP devs earn less. The syntax is super easy to pick up. Don't you want cheaper labor? I've started to learn the ecosystems of the other languages. It's all the same shit. Really.

makeitdouble 3y ago
I think php has a gentler learning curve, but you still need the same level of expertise to get something decent out of the door. From the recruiting side it's still a PITA to find good engineers and it's reflected in the final cost of hiring. I might be biased, but moving jobs every now and then had more impact than doing php or ruby (the other contender would be nodejs, I think go and python tend to be used on different purposes or complementary to the web stack)
iampims 3y ago
The best thing about PHP: shared nothing architecture. The worst thing about PHP: shared nothing architecture. It works extremely well until it doesn’t really scale anymore.
chuckadams 3y ago
I’ve written PHP off and on since the .php3 extension was a thing. People had very good reasons to hate PHP then. It’s greatly improved, but largely due to the composer ecosystem helping to paper over the worse bits. The global functions are still an awful mess.
- coxmi 3y ago
  Composer’s means of including packages doesn’t do the language any favours imo — it doubles down on namespaces (and complex PSR 4/7 ones at that) and the cli isn’t particularly intuitive. To me, what PHP needs is a simple module system with scoped functions and variables, an object literal syntax rather than `new \stdClass`, and first-class simple to use threading/async/promises for concurrent requests and IO.
mp05 3y ago
I think most people experienced PHP as the guilty party behind a lot of really, really terrible LAMP stack projects, but most of the time it was because mod_php was serving requests. I used PHP to run some service workers managed with supervisord and it was fine. I just get annoyed with the class-based hierarchy but I'd guess they've evolved since 2017 or whenever I used it last.

makeitdouble 3y ago

I think php has a gentler learning curve, but you still need the same level of expertise to get something decent out of the door. From the recruiting side it's still a PITA to find good engineers and it's reflected in the final cost of hiring. I might be biased, but moving jobs every now and then had more impact than doing php or ruby (the other contender would be nodejs, I think go and python tend to be used on different purposes or complementary to the web stack)

iampims 3y ago

The best thing about PHP: shared nothing architecture. The worst thing about PHP: shared nothing architecture. It works extremely well until it doesn’t really scale anymore.

chuckadams 3y ago

I’ve written PHP off and on since the .php3 extension was a thing. People had very good reasons to hate PHP then. It’s greatly improved, but largely due to the composer ecosystem helping to paper over the worse bits. The global functions are still an awful mess.

coxmi 3y ago
Composer’s means of including packages doesn’t do the language any favours imo — it doubles down on namespaces (and complex PSR 4/7 ones at that) and the cli isn’t particularly intuitive. To me, what PHP needs is a simple module system with scoped functions and variables, an object literal syntax rather than `new \stdClass`, and first-class simple to use threading/async/promises for concurrent requests and IO.

mp05 3y ago

I think most people experienced PHP as the guilty party behind a lot of really, really terrible LAMP stack projects, but most of the time it was because mod_php was serving requests. I used PHP to run some service workers managed with supervisord and it was fine. I just get annoyed with the class-based hierarchy but I'd guess they've evolved since 2017 or whenever I used it last.