5 ms·

You forgot the cost. Gas is much cheaper than electricity in most places.

Spartan-S63 2y ago
That's true, unless you have local generation that produces electricity cheaper than the grid supplies to you (i.e. rooftop solar).
StanislavPetrov 2y ago
Not just cheaper but more reliable. Here in New York I lose power several times a year - sometimes for multiple days at a time. In 5 decades I've never lost my gas.
- bell-cot 2y ago
  +1, and the reliability point would be better as a top-level comment. Perhaps also noting the cost and environmental impacts of most stove-grade electrical backup systems.
  - flakeoil 2y ago
    > stove-grade electrical backup systems What the heck is that? Where in the western world can't you run an electric induction stove? And what would the environmental impacts of that be? Gas leaks and gas explosions is nothing I see as benefits. And en electric stove also have many benefits over gas such as automatically turning off, timer based shut off etc.
    - bell-cot 2y ago
      >> stove-grade electrical backup systems > What the heck is that? Try searching for "UPS" on Amazon. How many of the search results would be capable of powering an electric stove (to cook meals) through a several-day electrical outage? If you looked at larger units (and generators) which were capable of doing that - what physical/electrical/safety issues would you face in actually connecting them to a typical residential stove? And once you're into the generators - those have their own fuel safety issues. > Where in the western world can't you run an electric induction stove? Anywhere that does not have electrical power available, during a power outage. Which the comment I was replying to very specifically pointed out.
      - amluto 2y ago
        “UPS” is the wrong search term. Buying a “UPS” gets you 1990-era tech for cleanly powering down a computer if the power fails or riding through a brown-out. You’re looking for an off-grid system or a hybrid system or a portable power station. A company like Ecoflow will happily sell you one for $600 or so that will power a perfectly nice induction stove at full blast for half an hour. (You don’t need full blast for very long to cook most meals — this is good for quite a lot of cooking.) Throw in a single solar panel and a patch of sun and it will keep you cooking indefinitely. Impulse Labs would like to sell you a really nice 4-pan stove with a built in battery that will ride through a decently long outage.
        bell-cot 2y ago
        Perhaps. But there's also the virtue of tech that just works, without everyone having to spend time & money researching/purchasing/maintaining/using backup systems to cover its frequent outages. Tech like those old gas stoves.
        bifrost 2y ago
        It has 3kwh and the stove costs $6k + installation. Based on their specs thats less than an hour. Gas stovetop costs $400 and just works.
      - flakeoil 2y ago
        Well, in most developed countries it happens very rarely (less than once a year) and when it happens it's typically in the minutes or maybe an hour range. As a backup I would recommend a camping stove that uses ethanol over using a UPS system.
        bell-cot 2y ago
        > Well, in most developed countries... Vs. the USA? Further up the chain of replies, this was specified: >>> Here in New York I lose power several times a year - sometimes for multiple days at a time. In 5 decades I've never lost my gas. And I know quite a few people in Michigan who had similar experiences last year. Total outage duration for many of them was >2 weeks. (I'll admit that, these days, "USA isn't really a developed country any more" is a credible argument.)
    - bifrost 2y ago
      Ever seen an electrical fire? Nasty business. It'd cost me $20k to install an induction stove, not buying it. I lose power in SF 3-4 times a year, have never lost gas. Last power outage I cooked with gas and it was great. I have gas heat too, always works.
- kergonath 2y ago
  Really? I think I’ve had 3 power cuts in 10 years (mostly in London), and none lasted more than 3 hours. What is so terrible about the state of electricity distribution in New York?
  - timbit42 2y ago
    Unrestrained capitalism.
  - prirun 2y ago
    I live in the Midwest, and we've had 2 instances of week-long power outages. Our power lines are overhead in many cases, and we have tornadoes. In 2012 we had an EF4 near here: 166-200mph winds! Overhead power lines do not handle flying trees very well. And even with high winds of 85mph, which is not uncommon, there are a lot of falling tree branches that cause downed power lines. My newer neighborhood (25 years old) has buried power lines, but it's fed from overhead power lines, so we still have power issues. I'm not advocating for gas over electric, just giving some perspective from another part of the world.
  - lupusreal 2y ago
    New York (the state, which is almost certainly what he's talking about) is mostly rural and has harsh winters. It gets a whole lot of snow dumped on it due to the lake effect. London winters are mild in comparison, and being a city, has more wires buried and thus protected anyway.
  - themaninthedark 2y ago
    A lot of rural and semi-rural area, which leads to above ground power lines as it is more expensive to bury them. Add in trees to the mix and you have the recipe for power outages. In the North East, usually a wet snow or freezing rain to ice will cause the branches to fall. In the South, drought will often weaken the trees and winds will will do the rest. Excessive rain can also cause problems when coupled with wind. The trees topple over, roots and all. Hurricanes and tornadoes will often cause prolonged outages, note that the wind form these can reach far inland and beyond what we consider the edge of the hurricane.
com2kid 2y ago
Induction stoves are almost 2x more efficient than gas stoves in regards to how much of the output energy ends up in the pot or pan. So unless gas is 1/2 the price of electricity where you are at, induction still wins! Oh and because gas puts approximately 50% of its heat into the environment and not the cookware, it can cause an increase in AC costs in the summer!
- CaptainMarvel 2y ago
  In the UK, gas has been roughly a quarter of the cost of electricity for decades. I find it hard to believe given global markets that it is more than half of the cost in more than just a few extreme parts of the world.
- imiric 2y ago
  > Oh and because gas puts approximately 50% of its heat into the environment and not the cookware, it can cause an increase in AC costs in the summer! Or a decrease in heating costs in the winter. :)

That's true, unless you have local generation that produces electricity cheaper than the grid supplies to you (i.e. rooftop solar).

StanislavPetrov 2y ago

Not just cheaper but more reliable. Here in New York I lose power several times a year - sometimes for multiple days at a time. In 5 decades I've never lost my gas.

bell-cot 2y ago
+1, and the reliability point would be better as a top-level comment. Perhaps also noting the cost and environmental impacts of most stove-grade electrical backup systems.
- flakeoil 2y ago
  > stove-grade electrical backup systems What the heck is that? Where in the western world can't you run an electric induction stove? And what would the environmental impacts of that be? Gas leaks and gas explosions is nothing I see as benefits. And en electric stove also have many benefits over gas such as automatically turning off, timer based shut off etc.
  - bell-cot 2y ago
    >> stove-grade electrical backup systems > What the heck is that? Try searching for "UPS" on Amazon. How many of the search results would be capable of powering an electric stove (to cook meals) through a several-day electrical outage? If you looked at larger units (and generators) which were capable of doing that - what physical/electrical/safety issues would you face in actually connecting them to a typical residential stove? And once you're into the generators - those have their own fuel safety issues. > Where in the western world can't you run an electric induction stove? Anywhere that does not have electrical power available, during a power outage. Which the comment I was replying to very specifically pointed out.
    - amluto 2y ago
      “UPS” is the wrong search term. Buying a “UPS” gets you 1990-era tech for cleanly powering down a computer if the power fails or riding through a brown-out. You’re looking for an off-grid system or a hybrid system or a portable power station. A company like Ecoflow will happily sell you one for $600 or so that will power a perfectly nice induction stove at full blast for half an hour. (You don’t need full blast for very long to cook most meals — this is good for quite a lot of cooking.) Throw in a single solar panel and a patch of sun and it will keep you cooking indefinitely. Impulse Labs would like to sell you a really nice 4-pan stove with a built in battery that will ride through a decently long outage.
      - bell-cot 2y ago
        Perhaps. But there's also the virtue of tech that just works, without everyone having to spend time & money researching/purchasing/maintaining/using backup systems to cover its frequent outages. Tech like those old gas stoves.
      - bifrost 2y ago
        It has 3kwh and the stove costs $6k + installation. Based on their specs thats less than an hour. Gas stovetop costs $400 and just works.
    - flakeoil 2y ago
      Well, in most developed countries it happens very rarely (less than once a year) and when it happens it's typically in the minutes or maybe an hour range. As a backup I would recommend a camping stove that uses ethanol over using a UPS system.
      - bell-cot 2y ago
        > Well, in most developed countries... Vs. the USA? Further up the chain of replies, this was specified: >>> Here in New York I lose power several times a year - sometimes for multiple days at a time. In 5 decades I've never lost my gas. And I know quite a few people in Michigan who had similar experiences last year. Total outage duration for many of them was >2 weeks. (I'll admit that, these days, "USA isn't really a developed country any more" is a credible argument.)
  - bifrost 2y ago
    Ever seen an electrical fire? Nasty business. It'd cost me $20k to install an induction stove, not buying it. I lose power in SF 3-4 times a year, have never lost gas. Last power outage I cooked with gas and it was great. I have gas heat too, always works.
kergonath 2y ago
Really? I think I’ve had 3 power cuts in 10 years (mostly in London), and none lasted more than 3 hours. What is so terrible about the state of electricity distribution in New York?
- timbit42 2y ago
  Unrestrained capitalism.
- prirun 2y ago
  I live in the Midwest, and we've had 2 instances of week-long power outages. Our power lines are overhead in many cases, and we have tornadoes. In 2012 we had an EF4 near here: 166-200mph winds! Overhead power lines do not handle flying trees very well. And even with high winds of 85mph, which is not uncommon, there are a lot of falling tree branches that cause downed power lines. My newer neighborhood (25 years old) has buried power lines, but it's fed from overhead power lines, so we still have power issues. I'm not advocating for gas over electric, just giving some perspective from another part of the world.
- lupusreal 2y ago
  New York (the state, which is almost certainly what he's talking about) is mostly rural and has harsh winters. It gets a whole lot of snow dumped on it due to the lake effect. London winters are mild in comparison, and being a city, has more wires buried and thus protected anyway.
- themaninthedark 2y ago
  A lot of rural and semi-rural area, which leads to above ground power lines as it is more expensive to bury them. Add in trees to the mix and you have the recipe for power outages. In the North East, usually a wet snow or freezing rain to ice will cause the branches to fall. In the South, drought will often weaken the trees and winds will will do the rest. Excessive rain can also cause problems when coupled with wind. The trees topple over, roots and all. Hurricanes and tornadoes will often cause prolonged outages, note that the wind form these can reach far inland and beyond what we consider the edge of the hurricane.

com2kid 2y ago

Induction stoves are almost 2x more efficient than gas stoves in regards to how much of the output energy ends up in the pot or pan. So unless gas is 1/2 the price of electricity where you are at, induction still wins! Oh and because gas puts approximately 50% of its heat into the environment and not the cookware, it can cause an increase in AC costs in the summer!

CaptainMarvel 2y ago
In the UK, gas has been roughly a quarter of the cost of electricity for decades. I find it hard to believe given global markets that it is more than half of the cost in more than just a few extreme parts of the world.
imiric 2y ago
> Oh and because gas puts approximately 50% of its heat into the environment and not the cookware, it can cause an increase in AC costs in the summer! Or a decrease in heating costs in the winter. :)