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A big problem here is BountySource was structured as a for-profit business. If someone pursued the same idea as a not-for-profit, this diversion of funds would

A big problem here is BountySource was structured as a for-profit business. If someone pursued the same idea as a not-for-profit, this diversion of funds would be less likely. Not impossible: it isn’t as if no not-for-profit has ever misused funds. But the system is set up to make that less likely, and to have greater legal recourse when it happens

donor20 3y ago
This is false. For profit companies clear and custody billions per day successfully. Brokerages, banks, title and escrow companies, clearing companies. Crypto/web3.0 - for some reason I always end up trusting these folks LESS not more
- skissane 3y ago
  > This is false. For profit companies clear and custody billions per day successfully. > Brokerages, banks, title and escrow companies, clearing companies. Those are all highly regulated industries. Some of them would love to put stuff in their T&Cs like BountySource’s “if the beneficiary doesn’t withdraw the money after 2 years we get to keep it” but the regulators would never let them. For a business like BountySource, that level of regulation does not exist
  - galaxyofdoom 3y ago
    [dead]
- bombcar 3y ago
  It is also naive - non profits have bountiful ways of making money disappear into pockets in all sorts of legal manners. It’s an entire industry - and by being non-profit they can be almost entirely impossible to “control” once the board is captured.
  - skissane 3y ago
    I think you’d want the money to be held by an organisation which is respectable and has some backing and track record - e.g. the OSI, FSF, Linux Foundation, Software Freedom Conservancy - orgs like that are unlikely to redirect the funds into something completely unrelated. There does need to be some flexibility however - e.g. if a project is defunct and nobody wants to work on it, it is stupid just to leave funding in a bank account forever. But if you give it to another open source project (preferably one in the same area) I think that is fine. Adding it to the coffers of a for-profit company isn’t And it might be reasonable for a not-for-profit to contract with a for-profit firm to administer such a funding scheme - but they should only be trustees of the funds (so if they go bankrupt the creditors can’t touch it) and they only get paid a defined percentage as a fee for service
  - xmodem 3y ago
    This obviously varies a lot by jurisdiction, but non-profits typically have much stricter transparency requirements than for-profit entities.
arp242 3y ago
There's fraud and embezzlement in non-profits all the time. Just entering that in a search engine shows tons of examples: https://duckduckgo.com/?t=ffab&q=fraud+and+embezzlement+in+non-profits https://duckduckgo.com/?t=ffab&q=fraud+and+embezzlement+in+n... When I was involved in scouts this was a thing as well; not even always due to malice, sometimes also due to incompetence and/or inattention.
- skissane 3y ago
  Yes, but the particular type of non-profit I had in mind – in a sibling reply I gave examples of the OSI, FSF, Linux Foundation, Software Freedom Conservancy – do groups like those have a history of fraud and embezzlement? Evidence of fraud in other, very different non-profits – which I agree exists – doesn't really answer that question

donor20 3y ago

This is false. For profit companies clear and custody billions per day successfully. Brokerages, banks, title and escrow companies, clearing companies. Crypto/web3.0 - for some reason I always end up trusting these folks LESS not more

skissane 3y ago
> This is false. For profit companies clear and custody billions per day successfully. > Brokerages, banks, title and escrow companies, clearing companies. Those are all highly regulated industries. Some of them would love to put stuff in their T&Cs like BountySource’s “if the beneficiary doesn’t withdraw the money after 2 years we get to keep it” but the regulators would never let them. For a business like BountySource, that level of regulation does not exist
- galaxyofdoom 3y ago
  [dead]
bombcar 3y ago
It is also naive - non profits have bountiful ways of making money disappear into pockets in all sorts of legal manners. It’s an entire industry - and by being non-profit they can be almost entirely impossible to “control” once the board is captured.
- skissane 3y ago
  I think you’d want the money to be held by an organisation which is respectable and has some backing and track record - e.g. the OSI, FSF, Linux Foundation, Software Freedom Conservancy - orgs like that are unlikely to redirect the funds into something completely unrelated. There does need to be some flexibility however - e.g. if a project is defunct and nobody wants to work on it, it is stupid just to leave funding in a bank account forever. But if you give it to another open source project (preferably one in the same area) I think that is fine. Adding it to the coffers of a for-profit company isn’t And it might be reasonable for a not-for-profit to contract with a for-profit firm to administer such a funding scheme - but they should only be trustees of the funds (so if they go bankrupt the creditors can’t touch it) and they only get paid a defined percentage as a fee for service
- xmodem 3y ago
  This obviously varies a lot by jurisdiction, but non-profits typically have much stricter transparency requirements than for-profit entities.

arp242 3y ago

There's fraud and embezzlement in non-profits all the time. Just entering that in a search engine shows tons of examples: https://duckduckgo.com/?t=ffab&q=fraud+and+embezzlement+in+non-profits https://duckduckgo.com/?t=ffab&q=fraud+and+embezzlement+in+n... When I was involved in scouts this was a thing as well; not even always due to malice, sometimes also due to incompetence and/or inattention.

skissane 3y ago
Yes, but the particular type of non-profit I had in mind – in a sibling reply I gave examples of the OSI, FSF, Linux Foundation, Software Freedom Conservancy – do groups like those have a history of fraud and embezzlement? Evidence of fraud in other, very different non-profits – which I agree exists – doesn't really answer that question