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> A lot of people seem to think that Google only does simple-minded matching of the users’ keywords with words that we indexed Oh what a dream if that were tru

> A lot of people seem to think that Google only does simple-minded matching of the users’ keywords with words that we indexed Oh what a dream if that were true! Instead, every year, the 'synonyms' get broader and broader. To me it looks like they're using synonyms of synonyms (of synonyms). One thing is surely true: Google abhors a vacuum, they will show you results, no matter how tenuously connected to your query.

Calavar 2y ago
> Oh what a dream if that were true! Instead, every year, the 'synonyms' get broader and broader. To me it looks like they're using synonyms of synonyms (of synonyms). Forget about synonyms of synonyms - I've seen antonyms bolded as matches in google search results. I have to imagine I'm not the only one.
- userbinator 2y ago
  I've also seen a few cases where it decided to cross out the word "not", basically inverting all the results.
  - a_wild_dandan 2y ago
    Google has slashed one term in my two word query. The results of this 50% query reduction, predictably, were complete trash.
- Viliam1234 2y ago
  Searching "how to do X on Linux" reliably returns "how to do X on Windows" and vice versa. There seems to be a part of algorithm smart enough to figure out that both Linux and Windows are operating systems, but not smart enough to realize that the difference usually matters a lot for the person asking the question.
asddubs 2y ago
I don't know why this is downvoted, it's overstating things a little but there's some truth to it for sure. The other day I was googling for the name of the \mid Latex math symbol. It's basically a pipe with some space around it, a separator line useful in definitions. So I tried to google various variations of "separator line latex math" but it always synonymed them to include "line break latex", which is obviously "\\" and not what I want.
- base698 2y ago
  I've found Google totally useless for all things LaTeX and resorted to using LLMs.
- bombcar 2y ago
  For what it’s worth Kagi gets what you wanted (I think) in the first four results for your first search.
- wizzwizz4 2y ago
  Fwiw, the usual method for finding LaTeX symbols is Detexify: https://detexify.kirelabs.org/classify.html https://detexify.kirelabs.org/classify.html
  - asddubs 2y ago
    Oh yeah, thanks for that. I actually knew about this but completely forgot it existed. Getting back into latex after not having used it for a while
- dkjaudyeqooe 2y ago
  Some people can't handle, or don't recognize, hyperbole. It was written, and was meant to be read in, an exasperated and slightly dramatic tone. I thought that was obvious from the opening sentence, but apparently not.
marginalia_nu 2y ago
While I agree that Google's query interpretation as it works right now is annoying and frustrating more than it is helpful, that's largely owing to how inscrutable it is. If you search for cats and get dogs, it's not obvious why that happened and not obvious how to prevent it from happening. That problem is in no way intrinsic to synonym generation, but likely a result of leaning too much into embeddings to do the heavy lifting. That said, skipping synonyms and other query variant generation is definitely throwing the baby out with the bathwater. When it works well it massively increases the recall of the search engine at very little loss of precision, which is important given the scale and noisiness of web results.
- dkjaudyeqooe 2y ago
  > That said, skipping synonyms and other query variant generation is definitely throwing the baby out with the bathwater. I disagree, I want control back. They've neutered almost every query narrowing option they used to have. They don't care anymore they just want to give you results. I'm not saying the, lets call it 'query automation', is always bad, I just want the option to turn it off to some degree. Apparently we can no longer be trusted with that.
  - marginalia_nu 2y ago
    There's really no reason why you couldn't still have control with e.g. a verbatim mode or quotes. This is a Google problem, not a search problem.

Calavar 2y ago

> Oh what a dream if that were true! Instead, every year, the 'synonyms' get broader and broader. To me it looks like they're using synonyms of synonyms (of synonyms). Forget about synonyms of synonyms - I've seen antonyms bolded as matches in google search results. I have to imagine I'm not the only one.

userbinator 2y ago
I've also seen a few cases where it decided to cross out the word "not", basically inverting all the results.
- a_wild_dandan 2y ago
  Google has slashed one term in my two word query. The results of this 50% query reduction, predictably, were complete trash.
Viliam1234 2y ago
Searching "how to do X on Linux" reliably returns "how to do X on Windows" and vice versa. There seems to be a part of algorithm smart enough to figure out that both Linux and Windows are operating systems, but not smart enough to realize that the difference usually matters a lot for the person asking the question.

asddubs 2y ago

I don't know why this is downvoted, it's overstating things a little but there's some truth to it for sure. The other day I was googling for the name of the \mid Latex math symbol. It's basically a pipe with some space around it, a separator line useful in definitions. So I tried to google various variations of "separator line latex math" but it always synonymed them to include "line break latex", which is obviously "\\" and not what I want.

base698 2y ago
I've found Google totally useless for all things LaTeX and resorted to using LLMs.
bombcar 2y ago
For what it’s worth Kagi gets what you wanted (I think) in the first four results for your first search.
wizzwizz4 2y ago
Fwiw, the usual method for finding LaTeX symbols is Detexify: https://detexify.kirelabs.org/classify.html https://detexify.kirelabs.org/classify.html
- asddubs 2y ago
  Oh yeah, thanks for that. I actually knew about this but completely forgot it existed. Getting back into latex after not having used it for a while
dkjaudyeqooe 2y ago
Some people can't handle, or don't recognize, hyperbole. It was written, and was meant to be read in, an exasperated and slightly dramatic tone. I thought that was obvious from the opening sentence, but apparently not.

marginalia_nu 2y ago

While I agree that Google's query interpretation as it works right now is annoying and frustrating more than it is helpful, that's largely owing to how inscrutable it is. If you search for cats and get dogs, it's not obvious why that happened and not obvious how to prevent it from happening. That problem is in no way intrinsic to synonym generation, but likely a result of leaning too much into embeddings to do the heavy lifting. That said, skipping synonyms and other query variant generation is definitely throwing the baby out with the bathwater. When it works well it massively increases the recall of the search engine at very little loss of precision, which is important given the scale and noisiness of web results.

dkjaudyeqooe 2y ago
> That said, skipping synonyms and other query variant generation is definitely throwing the baby out with the bathwater. I disagree, I want control back. They've neutered almost every query narrowing option they used to have. They don't care anymore they just want to give you results. I'm not saying the, lets call it 'query automation', is always bad, I just want the option to turn it off to some degree. Apparently we can no longer be trusted with that.
- marginalia_nu 2y ago
  There's really no reason why you couldn't still have control with e.g. a verbatim mode or quotes. This is a Google problem, not a search problem.