3 ms·

Isn’t all that true of the Covid vaccines, and they’re makers (including J&J)? I took them and was fine. So something is wrong in your logic

calculatte 3y ago
You're alive is the most you can say. Would you say the same if you develop cancer in 5 years? There is and was no long term testing, so enjoy being the experiment. You can't pretend those makers are all perfect. Who was it that was hit with the largest criminal fine in US history? And for what? "marketing the drug with the intent to deceive and mislead the public" weird.
kmeisthax 3y ago
As someone who got all three shots, and has no regrets: There's nothing wrong with their logic, it's just that my risk tolerances change based on the context. If I'm escaping from, say, a war; I'm not going to complain if the last flight out of the country is a Boeing 737 MAX - at least not until I'm in a safe country and can switch planes. Likewise, the risk tolerances for vaccines are extremely low normally[1], but I'm willing to accept a slightly riskier one if it means not getting infected with an extremely risky novel coronavirus with very well documented negative effects. Furthermore, the extremely politicized nature of the vaccine development process[0] constrains corporate misbehavior. In other words, the CEOs knew they had eyes on themselves and had to restrain themselves. Corporate misbehavior is far more likely when the public stops caring and corporations can start capturing regulatory agencies. In other words, their evil is very boring. "Company invents new vaccine that kills people" is an unusually sexy kind of evil, which means it gets unusually scrutinized. "Company neglects higher-than-average asbestos in talcum powder" is so boring nobody cares even after they get nasty cancer. [0] Which, oddly enough, resulted in Trump getting booed for taking credit for the vaccine he funded. [1] As far as I'm aware, these risks have not borne out into increased harm from the vaccines. I feel like there would have been a conservative media shitstorm if it had.
- hammock 3y ago
  If a company invented a drug that kills people, I don't think "extreme politicization" would be necessary for that company to have eyes and scrutiny on it. That would happen naturally. But in this case weren't the makers actually indemnified? Here's a CNBC article from 2020 called "You can’t sue Pfizer or Moderna if you have severe Covid vaccine side effects. The government likely won’t compensate you for damages." https://www.cnbc.com/2020/12/16/covid-vaccine-side-effects-compensation-lawsuit.html https://www.cnbc.com/2020/12/16/covid-vaccine-side-effects-c... Side note you mentioned you took "all" the vaccines but if you haven't gotten a dose since at least mid-Sept 2023, you are recommended to get another one: https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/stay-up-to-date.html#All https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/stay-up-t...
jonhohle 3y ago
Which were marketed as safe and effective and are now shown to be much less safe than disclosed and the manufacturers knew it (myocarditis and now a possible link to specific cancers[0]), and may or may not be effective depending on which study, cohort, and other factors. Many people took them and were fine, but that doesn’t mean all people who took them were fine.[1] 0 - https://www.cureus.com/articles/196275-increased-age-adjusted-cancer-mortality-after-the-third-mrna-lipid-nanoparticle-vaccine-dose-during-the-covid-19-pandemic-in-japan#!/ https://www.cureus.com/articles/196275-increased-age-adjuste... 1 - https://abcnews.go.com/amp/GMA/Food/panera-bread-issues-new-warning-charged-lemonades-amid/story?id=104502603 https://abcnews.go.com/amp/GMA/Food/panera-bread-issues-new-...

calculatte 3y ago

You're alive is the most you can say. Would you say the same if you develop cancer in 5 years? There is and was no long term testing, so enjoy being the experiment. You can't pretend those makers are all perfect. Who was it that was hit with the largest criminal fine in US history? And for what? "marketing the drug with the intent to deceive and mislead the public" weird.

kmeisthax 3y ago

As someone who got all three shots, and has no regrets: There's nothing wrong with their logic, it's just that my risk tolerances change based on the context. If I'm escaping from, say, a war; I'm not going to complain if the last flight out of the country is a Boeing 737 MAX - at least not until I'm in a safe country and can switch planes. Likewise, the risk tolerances for vaccines are extremely low normally[1], but I'm willing to accept a slightly riskier one if it means not getting infected with an extremely risky novel coronavirus with very well documented negative effects. Furthermore, the extremely politicized nature of the vaccine development process[0] constrains corporate misbehavior. In other words, the CEOs knew they had eyes on themselves and had to restrain themselves. Corporate misbehavior is far more likely when the public stops caring and corporations can start capturing regulatory agencies. In other words, their evil is very boring. "Company invents new vaccine that kills people" is an unusually sexy kind of evil, which means it gets unusually scrutinized. "Company neglects higher-than-average asbestos in talcum powder" is so boring nobody cares even after they get nasty cancer. [0] Which, oddly enough, resulted in Trump getting booed for taking credit for the vaccine he funded. [1] As far as I'm aware, these risks have not borne out into increased harm from the vaccines. I feel like there would have been a conservative media shitstorm if it had.

hammock 3y ago
If a company invented a drug that kills people, I don't think "extreme politicization" would be necessary for that company to have eyes and scrutiny on it. That would happen naturally. But in this case weren't the makers actually indemnified? Here's a CNBC article from 2020 called "You can’t sue Pfizer or Moderna if you have severe Covid vaccine side effects. The government likely won’t compensate you for damages." https://www.cnbc.com/2020/12/16/covid-vaccine-side-effects-compensation-lawsuit.html https://www.cnbc.com/2020/12/16/covid-vaccine-side-effects-c... Side note you mentioned you took "all" the vaccines but if you haven't gotten a dose since at least mid-Sept 2023, you are recommended to get another one: https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/stay-up-to-date.html#All https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/stay-up-t...

jonhohle 3y ago

Which were marketed as safe and effective and are now shown to be much less safe than disclosed and the manufacturers knew it (myocarditis and now a possible link to specific cancers[0]), and may or may not be effective depending on which study, cohort, and other factors. Many people took them and were fine, but that doesn’t mean all people who took them were fine.[1] 0 - https://www.cureus.com/articles/196275-increased-age-adjusted-cancer-mortality-after-the-third-mrna-lipid-nanoparticle-vaccine-dose-during-the-covid-19-pandemic-in-japan#!/ https://www.cureus.com/articles/196275-increased-age-adjuste... 1 - https://abcnews.go.com/amp/GMA/Food/panera-bread-issues-new-warning-charged-lemonades-amid/story?id=104502603 https://abcnews.go.com/amp/GMA/Food/panera-bread-issues-new-...