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> We’ve seen so many search engines launch with hype about it being the latest and greatest “Google killer” (Blekko, Cuil, Neeva, et al.) – then ultimately fail

> We’ve seen so many search engines launch with hype about it being the latest and greatest “Google killer” (Blekko, Cuil, Neeva, et al.) – then ultimately fail. Never even heard of those, to be honest. A quick HN search shows that they're ancient history. While the point is mostly valid, what was true even a few years ago is not necessarily true now. Timing isn't everything, but it comes pretty close. I'm not saying I have faith that OpenAI will be a meaningful search competitor to The Google, but that this is a case where the past may be even less likely to predict the future than it was already capable of. If, however, OpenAI invents a search that is not only smarter than The Google but better respects my desire to FTS the world-wide web, they will have my money. I'm a happy early adopter of Kagi, but they are clearly limited by whomever they buy their index from. > The reality? Google Search is always the real killer. This is largely a product of history and doesn't necessarily reflect whether The Google's search is indeed a "killer." If the search was launched today, it wouldn't be seen as particularly impressive. The Google was one of the earliest to market back when page "ranking" techniques mattered more and rode that "we're the cool/benevolent guys" image to the point that their search engine and other products are the default on bajillions of devices worldwide. It's a killer in the sense of ubiquity, but killers usually invite being killed themselves somewhere down the line.

dartos 2y ago
“Google” is now a common verb meaning “look it up on the internet” That’s a lot of inertia to fight against as a new search player. I bet it’ll be an api that can power smaller scale, specific search products (and also bing)
- ravenstine 2y ago
  Great point as well. I had to look it up to see what the actual origin may have been: https://www.dictionary.com/e/slang/google-it/ https://www.dictionary.com/e/slang/google-it/ It's possible that Larry Page himself may have started the whole "google" as a verb thing, though I'm sure he probably wasn't thinking about it that hard. In any case, at some point he must have patted himself on the back for being a part of making his company part of the English language. But yeah, language is not to be underestimated. Although Xerox isn't nearly as relevant as it used to be, there are still some people that are Millennial and older who still sometimes use "xerox" as a verb. Yes, I've heard this at FedEx Office, though I don't know if it's just regional to California. If Xerox ever tried to rise again in the public consciousness, I don't think it would take very long at all. As far as The Google is concerned, no one was seriously going to say "Just AltaVista it." And "Just Yahoo it" has an inherent awkwardness I can't describe.
  - troyvit 2y ago
    > As far as The Google is concerned, no one was seriously going to say "Just AltaVista it." And "Just Yahoo it" has an inherent awkwardness I can't describe. Even now in my kagi/duck-duck-go house, some of us still occasionally use the word "google" when we mean "search".
  - dartos 2y ago
    > And "Just Yahoo it" has an inherent awkwardness Maybe that’s because yahoo already has a meaning
- chipdart 2y ago
  > "Google” is now a common verb meaning “look it up on the internet” In the meantime ChatGPT is already a household name and is synonymous with querying a service to get it to generate answers.
  - dartos 2y ago
    I’ve never heard someone say “oh just chatgpt it.”
    - mbrumlow 2y ago
      I have. Even at work.
55555 2y ago
Small correction: as recently as last March, the CEO & Cofounder of Neeva, which I had never heard of either until listening, was on the No Priors AI podcast promoting Neeva, which had launched less than 2 years prior. So not ancient history. The podcast is a fascinating way to learn that you should really never believe a founder who is giving off an aura of success and growth as their company stunned everyone by announcing their shutdown around 30 days later, which obviously indicates that the CEO had been having internal discussions about how they were probably dead in the water at the same time he went on a podcast acting very positively. Which, I would probably do too. It's arguably in the job description. No judgement. But it was interesting enough to really stick with me.
jillesvangurp 2y ago
You don't disrupt a thing by doing exactly the same. So, I don't think it's likely that OpenAI is looking to build a website that gives you ten or so results and then you click one with maybe some ads on the side. What they are more likely to do is to use the web for RAG type approaches and use natural language to help you find what you are looking for in a chat (or voice) dialog that maybe involves repeated and increasingly more fine grained results that match what you are looking for. People do this manually with Google currently and it's time consuming. I remember doing this with Yahoo, Altavista, and all the other things that were around before Google came around to find academic papers for my research. Google made that a lot easier. But the next level of that might involve a lot less skimming through long lists of results, opening lots of websites, etc.

dartos 2y ago

“Google” is now a common verb meaning “look it up on the internet” That’s a lot of inertia to fight against as a new search player. I bet it’ll be an api that can power smaller scale, specific search products (and also bing)

ravenstine 2y ago
Great point as well. I had to look it up to see what the actual origin may have been: https://www.dictionary.com/e/slang/google-it/ https://www.dictionary.com/e/slang/google-it/ It's possible that Larry Page himself may have started the whole "google" as a verb thing, though I'm sure he probably wasn't thinking about it that hard. In any case, at some point he must have patted himself on the back for being a part of making his company part of the English language. But yeah, language is not to be underestimated. Although Xerox isn't nearly as relevant as it used to be, there are still some people that are Millennial and older who still sometimes use "xerox" as a verb. Yes, I've heard this at FedEx Office, though I don't know if it's just regional to California. If Xerox ever tried to rise again in the public consciousness, I don't think it would take very long at all. As far as The Google is concerned, no one was seriously going to say "Just AltaVista it." And "Just Yahoo it" has an inherent awkwardness I can't describe.
- troyvit 2y ago
  > As far as The Google is concerned, no one was seriously going to say "Just AltaVista it." And "Just Yahoo it" has an inherent awkwardness I can't describe. Even now in my kagi/duck-duck-go house, some of us still occasionally use the word "google" when we mean "search".
- dartos 2y ago
  > And "Just Yahoo it" has an inherent awkwardness Maybe that’s because yahoo already has a meaning
chipdart 2y ago
> "Google” is now a common verb meaning “look it up on the internet” In the meantime ChatGPT is already a household name and is synonymous with querying a service to get it to generate answers.
- dartos 2y ago
  I’ve never heard someone say “oh just chatgpt it.”
  - mbrumlow 2y ago
    I have. Even at work.

55555 2y ago

Small correction: as recently as last March, the CEO & Cofounder of Neeva, which I had never heard of either until listening, was on the No Priors AI podcast promoting Neeva, which had launched less than 2 years prior. So not ancient history. The podcast is a fascinating way to learn that you should really never believe a founder who is giving off an aura of success and growth as their company stunned everyone by announcing their shutdown around 30 days later, which obviously indicates that the CEO had been having internal discussions about how they were probably dead in the water at the same time he went on a podcast acting very positively. Which, I would probably do too. It's arguably in the job description. No judgement. But it was interesting enough to really stick with me.

jillesvangurp 2y ago

You don't disrupt a thing by doing exactly the same. So, I don't think it's likely that OpenAI is looking to build a website that gives you ten or so results and then you click one with maybe some ads on the side. What they are more likely to do is to use the web for RAG type approaches and use natural language to help you find what you are looking for in a chat (or voice) dialog that maybe involves repeated and increasingly more fine grained results that match what you are looking for. People do this manually with Google currently and it's time consuming. I remember doing this with Yahoo, Altavista, and all the other things that were around before Google came around to find academic papers for my research. Google made that a lot easier. But the next level of that might involve a lot less skimming through long lists of results, opening lots of websites, etc.