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I know this is a downvote-worthy comment, but I have to say I feel like people who don't like Elon Musk think the alternative is someone just like him but with

I know this is a downvote-worthy comment, but I have to say I feel like people who don't like Elon Musk think the alternative is someone just like him but with all his flaws removed. The overwhelming alternative is people who never make anything advance and talk like this: > In a fast-moving and competitive satellite communication industry, this transaction expands our multi-orbit space network, spectrum portfolio, ground infrastructure around the world, go-to-market capabilities, managed service solutions, and financial profile

amarant 3y ago
I think a large part of the problem is that a lot of people seem to have trouble consolidating that someone can have both positive and negative qualities at the same time.
- admissionsguy 3y ago
  People are disconcerted by the fact that Musk is just a human like them who happens to wield huge resources. They prefer to think of the elite class as their betters, a separate category, hence the convention for the “ruling class” to have decorum, present curated image, and so on.
  - hobs 3y ago
    He doesn't meet the standards of behavior of any class that I would associate with.
    - throwitaway222 3y ago
      It is unfortunate that the left doesn't want to talk to anyone any more. However, IRL I bet you would be bowing and shaking his hand if you had the op.
      - hobs 3y ago
        Hilarious comment, I would be glad to reach my hand out so I can squeeze his baby flesh.
- martijnarts 3y ago
  While I think that's at play, I also think it's entirely fair to hold those with more power to higher standards.
  - HPsquared 3y ago
    Standards are set by those with power. A bit of a tautology.
  - amarant 3y ago
    It is entirely fair to do so. And I'm not a huge fan of a lot of things Elon has written on Twitter. I don't really care about him buying it too much, but that's at least partially because I don't use it and never did. Anyway, what really gets me is people denying that Elon has some real chops when it comes to engineering and business management. A lot of people even take it one step further and pretend like Tesla isn't a capable EV producer, because Elon once wrote something on twitter that upset them. The problem there isn't that they're upset with Elon, that's totally fine, he frequently earns that. But being unable to recognize that he had also done some good work that is completely unrelated to those silly remarks on twitter, that is the problem. This phenomenon should not be confused with criticizing actual flaws in any work Elon has done, which is of course great, but that's very often not what's happening in "discussions" about his companies.
anonymousab 3y ago
> think the alternative is someone just like him but with all his flaws removed Or just some other person, successful or not. It's far from a dichotomy. There are plenty of successful companies and CEOs out there.
AnimalMuppet 3y ago
"In a fast-moving and competitive satellite communication industry, we, who cannot move nearly as fast and are therefore no longer competitive, hope that this will somehow make us look like we're still relevant." OK, that's a very cynical take. But Starlink is revolutionizing the business, and historically, merging is what the dinosaur companies often do after the revolution hits. Think of the mergers between Unix workstation vendors as the PC was revolutionizing computing. Merging lets you get bigger. But in a revolutionary environment, faster wins, bigger doesn't. Merging is therefore a useless response. (In fact, it's worse than useless, because it slows you down.)
- jandrese 3y ago
  I view these mergers as the executives cashing out of their failing company.
- abakker 3y ago
  Yes, now they both get to begin an 18 month "Synergy Period" where both companies focus on navel-gazing to instead of the clients who are cancelling contracts and buying starlink.
- vladms 3y ago
  Revolutions are much easier to spot afterwards. Maybe Starlink will be a revolution, but maybe more and more people will get better wired access (so new subscriptions will slow). I don't think it's that evident now how it will go overall. What alternative would you propose to merging? If the market re-stabilizes in a different position merging could be successful. If a revolution happens, it will probably not, but still better than doing nothing.
  - AnimalMuppet 3y ago
    > What alternative would you propose to merging? I don't know. > but still better than doing nothing. Maybe not. Maybe it takes away management attention from figuring out how to actually be competitive in the new environment. "We have to do something; this is something; therefore we have to do this" is rarely the right thing to do. It's often just a mask for "we don't know what to do". On the other hand, "we can't figure out what to do, but we're dead if we don't do something, so we're going to do something and hope that it randomly turns out to be useful" may have a higher expectation value than doing nothing.
Retric 3y ago
With Tesla the comparison wasn’t nobody it was the original founders continuing to operate the company. Which may have been less successful, but the first Roadster was delivered in February 2008 while he became CEO in 2008. So the EV revolution would have almost certainly started with or without him. SpaceX was a high risk venture that paid off, props.
runako 3y ago
> with all his flaws removed Most CEOs do not spend $44 billion USD to broadcast their most abhorrent thoughts to the world. Everyone is flawed, but nobody likes a loud boor.
- MangoCoffee 3y ago
  its his money.
  - runako 3y ago
    Some of it is his money. Some was borrowed.
    - cryptonector 3y ago
      The lenders knew what he meant to do.
      - runako 3y ago
        Literally just responding to this: > its his money.
        cryptonector 3y ago
        But that some of the money is borrowed can't mean that he can't say the things he does, especially when the lenders knew who he was to begin with.
        runako 3y ago
        I am not saying he can't say whatever he wants. My initial response was to the notion that any other person as CEO of SpaceX (or Tesla) would also be flawed. Which, obviously. But it is simply not the case that most CEOs are as loud about broadcasting their whims to the world. Tesla is 12th largest public company by market cap, between Broadcom and Novo Nordisk. Those companies have CEOs, but those CEOs do not habitually make controversial statements on Internet fora. It is possible for a person to be flawed, but not to spend effort ensuring wide distribution of those flaws.

amarant 3y ago

I think a large part of the problem is that a lot of people seem to have trouble consolidating that someone can have both positive and negative qualities at the same time.

admissionsguy 3y ago
People are disconcerted by the fact that Musk is just a human like them who happens to wield huge resources. They prefer to think of the elite class as their betters, a separate category, hence the convention for the “ruling class” to have decorum, present curated image, and so on.
- hobs 3y ago
  He doesn't meet the standards of behavior of any class that I would associate with.
  - throwitaway222 3y ago
    It is unfortunate that the left doesn't want to talk to anyone any more. However, IRL I bet you would be bowing and shaking his hand if you had the op.
    - hobs 3y ago
      Hilarious comment, I would be glad to reach my hand out so I can squeeze his baby flesh.
martijnarts 3y ago
While I think that's at play, I also think it's entirely fair to hold those with more power to higher standards.
- HPsquared 3y ago
  Standards are set by those with power. A bit of a tautology.
- amarant 3y ago
  It is entirely fair to do so. And I'm not a huge fan of a lot of things Elon has written on Twitter. I don't really care about him buying it too much, but that's at least partially because I don't use it and never did. Anyway, what really gets me is people denying that Elon has some real chops when it comes to engineering and business management. A lot of people even take it one step further and pretend like Tesla isn't a capable EV producer, because Elon once wrote something on twitter that upset them. The problem there isn't that they're upset with Elon, that's totally fine, he frequently earns that. But being unable to recognize that he had also done some good work that is completely unrelated to those silly remarks on twitter, that is the problem. This phenomenon should not be confused with criticizing actual flaws in any work Elon has done, which is of course great, but that's very often not what's happening in "discussions" about his companies.

anonymousab 3y ago

> think the alternative is someone just like him but with all his flaws removed Or just some other person, successful or not. It's far from a dichotomy. There are plenty of successful companies and CEOs out there.

AnimalMuppet 3y ago

"In a fast-moving and competitive satellite communication industry, we, who cannot move nearly as fast and are therefore no longer competitive, hope that this will somehow make us look like we're still relevant." OK, that's a very cynical take. But Starlink is revolutionizing the business, and historically, merging is what the dinosaur companies often do after the revolution hits. Think of the mergers between Unix workstation vendors as the PC was revolutionizing computing. Merging lets you get bigger. But in a revolutionary environment, faster wins, bigger doesn't. Merging is therefore a useless response. (In fact, it's worse than useless, because it slows you down.)

jandrese 3y ago
I view these mergers as the executives cashing out of their failing company.
abakker 3y ago
Yes, now they both get to begin an 18 month "Synergy Period" where both companies focus on navel-gazing to instead of the clients who are cancelling contracts and buying starlink.
vladms 3y ago
Revolutions are much easier to spot afterwards. Maybe Starlink will be a revolution, but maybe more and more people will get better wired access (so new subscriptions will slow). I don't think it's that evident now how it will go overall. What alternative would you propose to merging? If the market re-stabilizes in a different position merging could be successful. If a revolution happens, it will probably not, but still better than doing nothing.
- AnimalMuppet 3y ago
  > What alternative would you propose to merging? I don't know. > but still better than doing nothing. Maybe not. Maybe it takes away management attention from figuring out how to actually be competitive in the new environment. "We have to do something; this is something; therefore we have to do this" is rarely the right thing to do. It's often just a mask for "we don't know what to do". On the other hand, "we can't figure out what to do, but we're dead if we don't do something, so we're going to do something and hope that it randomly turns out to be useful" may have a higher expectation value than doing nothing.

Retric 3y ago

With Tesla the comparison wasn’t nobody it was the original founders continuing to operate the company. Which may have been less successful, but the first Roadster was delivered in February 2008 while he became CEO in 2008. So the EV revolution would have almost certainly started with or without him. SpaceX was a high risk venture that paid off, props.

runako 3y ago

> with all his flaws removed Most CEOs do not spend $44 billion USD to broadcast their most abhorrent thoughts to the world. Everyone is flawed, but nobody likes a loud boor.

MangoCoffee 3y ago
its his money.
- runako 3y ago
  Some of it is his money. Some was borrowed.
  - cryptonector 3y ago
    The lenders knew what he meant to do.
    - runako 3y ago
      Literally just responding to this: > its his money.
      - cryptonector 3y ago
        But that some of the money is borrowed can't mean that he can't say the things he does, especially when the lenders knew who he was to begin with.
        runako 3y ago
        I am not saying he can't say whatever he wants. My initial response was to the notion that any other person as CEO of SpaceX (or Tesla) would also be flawed. Which, obviously. But it is simply not the case that most CEOs are as loud about broadcasting their whims to the world. Tesla is 12th largest public company by market cap, between Broadcom and Novo Nordisk. Those companies have CEOs, but those CEOs do not habitually make controversial statements on Internet fora. It is possible for a person to be flawed, but not to spend effort ensuring wide distribution of those flaws.