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For a while I thought Tesla was bucking that trend but that no longer appears to be the case The correct choice for a car is a Japanese one

treprinum 2y ago
Recent Toyotas (Yaris, CH-R, RAV4) were listed among the most buggy cars in Europe... Mitsubishi is now openly selling rebadged Renaults that aren't known for their longevity either. Even luxury European brands are becoming cheapened - Mercedes is now selling cars with Dacia/Renault engines.
- n4r9 2y ago
  > Toyotas (Yaris, CH-R, RAV4) were listed among the most buggy cars in Europe Where are you getting that from? Toyotas are famously some of the most reliable cars you can buy.
  - hughesjj 2y ago
    Only for hardware
  - WesolyKubeczek 2y ago
    They are reliable, and yet they have snafus. For example, my Yaris came with a fuel tank that had a defective valve, and I had to trickle gas into it instead of fueling it normally. I basically had the trickle at 300 ml/s or so. The dealership replaced the whole tank for me under warranty as aygos and yarises now have monolithic plastic contraptions for their fuel tanks and you can’t just replace the inlet valve or what have they. It’s been solid and low maintenance since. But the dealer acknowledged they had seen this as a somewhat systemic problem. Then in winter, I had my HUD just shut off with no explanation. It came back a day later, worked ok since. Then again, you need to treat the bottom of your car as soon as you buy it because it tends to corrode like mad. You don’t want your car to disintegrate on you in five years, do you? I gather higher end models like RAV4 get more QC, and mine are mostly first world problems, but you can see repair-unfriendly and “just buy a new one” attitude creeping in.
  - treprinum 2y ago
    ADAC long-term reliability report: https://www.adac.de/rund-ums-fahrzeug/unfall-schaden-panne/adac-pannenstatistik/#tops-und-flops-der-pannenstatistik- https://www.adac.de/rund-ums-fahrzeug/unfall-schaden-panne/a... See the table "Modellvergleich: Sieger & Verlierer" and navigate to the car category you want to see.
    - n4r9 2y ago
      Interesting. It seems to be the 2021 model specifically that is bad for the Yaris. 27.8% breakdown rate?! That seems crazy. Is the source data available anywhere?
- Glawen 2y ago
  Maybe luxury brands figured out Renault made better car? :)
Ekaros 2y ago
Was Tesla ever a car you wanted if you wanted quality, that is good fit and finish. Consistent gaps on panels. Suspension not breaking in regular use... You know absolute basics I get for fraction of the price from Koreans for example.
BrandoElFollito 2y ago
I have a Toyota RAV4. Never again. This is a car designed in what seems to be 1974. The electronics are horrendous. The design is horrendous (inside). It runs like any other average car.

treprinum 2y ago

Recent Toyotas (Yaris, CH-R, RAV4) were listed among the most buggy cars in Europe... Mitsubishi is now openly selling rebadged Renaults that aren't known for their longevity either. Even luxury European brands are becoming cheapened - Mercedes is now selling cars with Dacia/Renault engines.

n4r9 2y ago
> Toyotas (Yaris, CH-R, RAV4) were listed among the most buggy cars in Europe Where are you getting that from? Toyotas are famously some of the most reliable cars you can buy.
- hughesjj 2y ago
  Only for hardware
- WesolyKubeczek 2y ago
  They are reliable, and yet they have snafus. For example, my Yaris came with a fuel tank that had a defective valve, and I had to trickle gas into it instead of fueling it normally. I basically had the trickle at 300 ml/s or so. The dealership replaced the whole tank for me under warranty as aygos and yarises now have monolithic plastic contraptions for their fuel tanks and you can’t just replace the inlet valve or what have they. It’s been solid and low maintenance since. But the dealer acknowledged they had seen this as a somewhat systemic problem. Then in winter, I had my HUD just shut off with no explanation. It came back a day later, worked ok since. Then again, you need to treat the bottom of your car as soon as you buy it because it tends to corrode like mad. You don’t want your car to disintegrate on you in five years, do you? I gather higher end models like RAV4 get more QC, and mine are mostly first world problems, but you can see repair-unfriendly and “just buy a new one” attitude creeping in.
- treprinum 2y ago
  ADAC long-term reliability report: https://www.adac.de/rund-ums-fahrzeug/unfall-schaden-panne/adac-pannenstatistik/#tops-und-flops-der-pannenstatistik- https://www.adac.de/rund-ums-fahrzeug/unfall-schaden-panne/a... See the table "Modellvergleich: Sieger & Verlierer" and navigate to the car category you want to see.
  - n4r9 2y ago
    Interesting. It seems to be the 2021 model specifically that is bad for the Yaris. 27.8% breakdown rate?! That seems crazy. Is the source data available anywhere?
Glawen 2y ago
Maybe luxury brands figured out Renault made better car? :)

Ekaros 2y ago

Was Tesla ever a car you wanted if you wanted quality, that is good fit and finish. Consistent gaps on panels. Suspension not breaking in regular use... You know absolute basics I get for fraction of the price from Koreans for example.

BrandoElFollito 2y ago

I have a Toyota RAV4. Never again. This is a car designed in what seems to be 1974. The electronics are horrendous. The design is horrendous (inside). It runs like any other average car.