3 ms·

Don't Lie in Interviews

JohnFen 2y ago
Excellent essay! > If your model is "it's okay to lie if I've been lied to" then we're all knee deep in bullshit forever and can never escape Transaction Cost Hell. Not only that, but people who do this are allowing others to strip them of something important and valuable. It's letting others set your ethical boundaries. As my mother used to say, it's letting others drag you down to their level. That bad people exist cannot be an excuse to become a bad person yourself.
- OkayPhysicist 2y ago
  You're assuming a deontological basis for ethical rules: "These are the rules because these are the rules" as opposed to a consequentialist formulation of ethical rules "I follow these rules because it results in some greater utility". In the former framing, rules tend to be more universal, "Thou shall not steal" type universal. In the latter framework, rules are more "rules of thumb", which let people engage with each other in good faith to maximize utility. If you know, for a fact, that your counterparty is operating in bad faith, and is committed to doing so, there is very little utility in you remaining committed to those rules.
  - JohnFen 2y ago
    > You're assuming a deontological basis for ethical rules I am not at all. What I'm doing is saying that if a person thinks lying is unethical, then lying is an unethical behavior by their own code. If a person doesn't, then (in my ethical viewpoint, because it's a form of fraud), the person is unethical as a baseline and should at the very least own up to that. That includes such excuses as "they lie to me, so it's OK to lie to them" or "that's just how the game is played." Such people should be avoided/not hired.
bishbosh 2y ago
I think the high minded philosophizing about the morality of a world littered with endless lies falls in the face of the reality of many people's lives. We are already knee deep in bullshit. Jobs will lie about compensation, requirements, duties, advancement, and culture, but what a sickened world we would suddenly occupy if one lies to meet the false requirements.
- nullfield 2y ago
  Game theory has some things to say about this, and the expected long term outcomes for everyone aren’t good. Employers could use some study in the subject, but I’m firmly convinced this is past the capability of HR departments in general. I mean, they call themselves “HR”, which tells you about all you need to know about how they think about you.

Excellent essay! > If your model is "it's okay to lie if I've been lied to" then we're all knee deep in bullshit forever and can never escape Transaction Cost Hell. Not only that, but people who do this are allowing others to strip them of something important and valuable. It's letting others set your ethical boundaries. As my mother used to say, it's letting others drag you down to their level. That bad people exist cannot be an excuse to become a bad person yourself.

OkayPhysicist 2y ago
You're assuming a deontological basis for ethical rules: "These are the rules because these are the rules" as opposed to a consequentialist formulation of ethical rules "I follow these rules because it results in some greater utility". In the former framing, rules tend to be more universal, "Thou shall not steal" type universal. In the latter framework, rules are more "rules of thumb", which let people engage with each other in good faith to maximize utility. If you know, for a fact, that your counterparty is operating in bad faith, and is committed to doing so, there is very little utility in you remaining committed to those rules.
- JohnFen 2y ago
  > You're assuming a deontological basis for ethical rules I am not at all. What I'm doing is saying that if a person thinks lying is unethical, then lying is an unethical behavior by their own code. If a person doesn't, then (in my ethical viewpoint, because it's a form of fraud), the person is unethical as a baseline and should at the very least own up to that. That includes such excuses as "they lie to me, so it's OK to lie to them" or "that's just how the game is played." Such people should be avoided/not hired.

bishbosh 2y ago

I think the high minded philosophizing about the morality of a world littered with endless lies falls in the face of the reality of many people's lives. We are already knee deep in bullshit. Jobs will lie about compensation, requirements, duties, advancement, and culture, but what a sickened world we would suddenly occupy if one lies to meet the false requirements.

nullfield 2y ago
Game theory has some things to say about this, and the expected long term outcomes for everyone aren’t good. Employers could use some study in the subject, but I’m firmly convinced this is past the capability of HR departments in general. I mean, they call themselves “HR”, which tells you about all you need to know about how they think about you.