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And yet emulators get discontinued because of legal action: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yuzu_(emulator) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yuzu_(emulator) > On Fe

by thih9 3y ago

And yet emulators get discontinued because of legal action: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yuzu_(emulator) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yuzu_(emulator) > On February 26, 2024, Nintendo of America filed a lawsuit against Tropic Haze LLC, the legal entity behind Yuzu's development. Development and official distribution of Yuzu ceased on March 4, 2024, after Tropic Haze settled the lawsuit with Nintendo of America for $2.4 million.

EMIRELADERO 3y ago
That was because the devs were idiots who kept a "stash" of pirated games on a shared server. They would have been cooked in discovery if the lawsuit progressed. A dev team that was actually clean and didn't pirate a single thing would have done much better.
- Charon77 3y ago
  Could you elaborate? I think I totally miss this subtleties
  - darkwater 3y ago
    I think GP is implying that the main goal of the Yuzu emulator was explicitly pirating Nintendo games, unless other emulation projects where enabling piracy is just a side-effect, so to speak.
    - EMIRELADERO 3y ago
      No, that wasn't the main goal, but the developers had their own private NAS and discord server where they shared pirated switch ROMs. That would have killed them if (when) it came out in the lawsuit so they decided to end it right there. Notice how the other emulator, Ryujinx, isn't being targeted. There is no talk of a dev "stash" on its discord server.
      - philistine 3y ago
        The main thing people are forgetting is how Yuzu presented itself. They made a big thing out of support for 4k60 Tears of the Kingdom on PC before the game was released. The marketing people inside Nintendo must have been completely furious to have their supremely controlled media cycle completely sidetracked by them. They clearly sicked the legal department on them after that. Any time an emulator developer, or a fan game artist gets a cease and desist from Nintendo, it's always because marketing gets wind of their existence.
        crtasm 3y ago
        >They made a big thing out of support for 4k60 Tears of the Kingdom on PC before the game was released. Citation please? Yuzu couldn't start the game at all without a patch, which I don't believe was being promoted by the Yuzu team. Of course the patch + game + yuzu got bundled together and offered as a download on many websites, perhaps this is what you're thinking of.
        babypuncher 3y ago
        I don't have much empathy for the Yuzu team precisely because of this. Nintendo is notoriously litigious but has been careful not to go after all the completely fair and legal emulation projects out there. The Yuzu people were playing with fire in a big way. Pirating brand new games has nothing to do with preservation. Ultimately, Ryujinx's emphasis on accuracy makes it the better Switch emulator for actual preservation anyways, and I imagine that project is seeing a lot more support now that Yuzu is dead.
- dangus 3y ago
  IIRC Yuzu also monetized.
- accrual 3y ago
  Didn't they also accept payment via Patreon? That's also a big red flag for Nintendo since they are now profiting from the work.
  - EMIRELADERO 3y ago
    It's not really a red flag as it doesn't change the legality.
- crtasm 3y ago
  Do you have a link to reporting on this stash of games? First I've heard of it.
benchloftbrunch 3y ago
Nintendo's entire argument in that case revolved around the unauthorized use of their encryption keys to bypass their DRM. None of the consoles mentioned in this manpage use encryption this way (and aren't powerful enough to do so in software.) So they're fine. IANAL. Note that 10NES style lockout systems are NOT "technological protection measures" under the DMCA, because they don't restrict access to the copyrighted works themselves (the games), but instead restrict what games the console will play. The one Game Boy emu dev who canceled their project was being overly cautious
SllX 3y ago
If you’re not going to go into the specifics of why then this is FUD. I’m calling it out because this FUD has been widespread across multiple discussion communities including this one. Tropic Haze (Yuzu) didn’t settle because all they were doing is writing an emulator. As others have pointed out, Nintendo had very strong reason to believe the Yuzu devs were engaged in outright and flagrant piracy. Among the allegations in Nintendo’s filing was that the devs (who publicly bragged about launch day support for new releases) were contributing the compatibility patches for new games prior to release. Further, Tropic Haze didn’t lose the lawsuit in the sense that they went to court and had a judgement against them. They likely knew they were cooked and chose to settle. For more on the legality of emulation in the US, review Sony vs Connectix.
anonbanker 3y ago
Devteam was using the official Switch SDK to develop, like a bunch of absolute morons.

by thih9 3y ago

EMIRELADERO 3y ago

That was because the devs were idiots who kept a "stash" of pirated games on a shared server. They would have been cooked in discovery if the lawsuit progressed. A dev team that was actually clean and didn't pirate a single thing would have done much better.

Charon77 3y ago
Could you elaborate? I think I totally miss this subtleties
- darkwater 3y ago
  I think GP is implying that the main goal of the Yuzu emulator was explicitly pirating Nintendo games, unless other emulation projects where enabling piracy is just a side-effect, so to speak.
  - EMIRELADERO 3y ago
    No, that wasn't the main goal, but the developers had their own private NAS and discord server where they shared pirated switch ROMs. That would have killed them if (when) it came out in the lawsuit so they decided to end it right there. Notice how the other emulator, Ryujinx, isn't being targeted. There is no talk of a dev "stash" on its discord server.
    - philistine 3y ago
      The main thing people are forgetting is how Yuzu presented itself. They made a big thing out of support for 4k60 Tears of the Kingdom on PC before the game was released. The marketing people inside Nintendo must have been completely furious to have their supremely controlled media cycle completely sidetracked by them. They clearly sicked the legal department on them after that. Any time an emulator developer, or a fan game artist gets a cease and desist from Nintendo, it's always because marketing gets wind of their existence.
      - crtasm 3y ago
        >They made a big thing out of support for 4k60 Tears of the Kingdom on PC before the game was released. Citation please? Yuzu couldn't start the game at all without a patch, which I don't believe was being promoted by the Yuzu team. Of course the patch + game + yuzu got bundled together and offered as a download on many websites, perhaps this is what you're thinking of.
      - babypuncher 3y ago
        I don't have much empathy for the Yuzu team precisely because of this. Nintendo is notoriously litigious but has been careful not to go after all the completely fair and legal emulation projects out there. The Yuzu people were playing with fire in a big way. Pirating brand new games has nothing to do with preservation. Ultimately, Ryujinx's emphasis on accuracy makes it the better Switch emulator for actual preservation anyways, and I imagine that project is seeing a lot more support now that Yuzu is dead.
dangus 3y ago
IIRC Yuzu also monetized.
accrual 3y ago
Didn't they also accept payment via Patreon? That's also a big red flag for Nintendo since they are now profiting from the work.
- EMIRELADERO 3y ago
  It's not really a red flag as it doesn't change the legality.
crtasm 3y ago
Do you have a link to reporting on this stash of games? First I've heard of it.

benchloftbrunch 3y ago

Nintendo's entire argument in that case revolved around the unauthorized use of their encryption keys to bypass their DRM. None of the consoles mentioned in this manpage use encryption this way (and aren't powerful enough to do so in software.) So they're fine. IANAL. Note that 10NES style lockout systems are NOT "technological protection measures" under the DMCA, because they don't restrict access to the copyrighted works themselves (the games), but instead restrict what games the console will play. The one Game Boy emu dev who canceled their project was being overly cautious

SllX 3y ago

If you’re not going to go into the specifics of why then this is FUD. I’m calling it out because this FUD has been widespread across multiple discussion communities including this one. Tropic Haze (Yuzu) didn’t settle because all they were doing is writing an emulator. As others have pointed out, Nintendo had very strong reason to believe the Yuzu devs were engaged in outright and flagrant piracy. Among the allegations in Nintendo’s filing was that the devs (who publicly bragged about launch day support for new releases) were contributing the compatibility patches for new games prior to release. Further, Tropic Haze didn’t lose the lawsuit in the sense that they went to court and had a judgement against them. They likely knew they were cooked and chose to settle. For more on the legality of emulation in the US, review Sony vs Connectix.

anonbanker 3y ago

Devteam was using the official Switch SDK to develop, like a bunch of absolute morons.