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My life would have taken a different and probably less computer-centered path if I hadn't found the act of writing physically uncomfortable. From the day I lear

My life would have taken a different and probably less computer-centered path if I hadn't found the act of writing physically uncomfortable. From the day I learned to write all the way through to the present, it doesn't take more than a couple of minutes for my hand to begin aching. How fascinating it would be to be one of those people who can put pen to page for hours at a time, or buzz out notes in real-time then look down without being repulsed at the form of their handwriting.

johngossman 2y ago
Fwiw...I had no hand problems and excellent handwriting. People used to ask me to transcribe their notes for handouts. And after about age 20, I almost completely abandoned it in favor of keyboards. All to say, your life might not have been any different
cylinder714 2y ago
A couple of thoughts: - I met a clerk at a bakery I frequented (for business, not pleasure) who made a tight fist with a pen whenever she wrote down an order. How do you hold a pen or pencil? I think the ideal is to hold it as lightly as possible with your thumb, fore- and middle fingers. - A fountain pen has the least amount of friction of any writing instrument; I learned to write with one in grade school, and managed to forget it later. But I recently picked up a cheap Zebra V-301 for USD$5 and am trying it again.
kstrauser 2y ago
Same for me. I bought a Lamy Safari fountain pen with a triangular grip that sort of forces me to hold it the “right” way, and it was transformative. What, handwriting can be pain-free? And I don’t have to consciously remember to adjust my grip because it pushes me that way? Miracles! More info here: https://www.themanual.com/culture/different-types-of-pencil-grips/ https://www.themanual.com/culture/different-types-of-pencil-... My hand wants to use the lateral tripod grip by default, leading to me gripping the pen too hard and my hand hurting. The Safari gets me to use the dynamic tripod grip which is vastly more comfortable. They’re both considered “mature” grips, but one is much better for writing lots of text in one sitting.
- causality0 2y ago
  My grip has always been the dynamic tripod. Never helped.
  - kstrauser 2y ago
    Got it. I’m glad I can choose to write short bits of text when I want to, and can use a keyboard for anything nontrivial. Handwriting is easier for me now and yet I’d vastly prefer to type.
bikenaga 2y ago
Years ago in a discussion (here, I think) on fountain pens people were complaining about their hands cramping up when writing. Someone suggested the following: Put the pen between your index and middle fingers. The idea is that the lengths of the fingers provide passive support for the pen on both sides. By restricting the range of motion of the pen sideways, you don't have to exert as much force to control the pen to write. I tried it and it's great --- I haven't done it any other way since. I've learned lots of things reading HN but this might have been the best.
- brianush1 2y ago
  > Put the pen between your index and middle fingers. I'm genuinely curious, how else could you hold a pen?
  - bikenaga 2y ago
    Doing it the "standard" way (at least the way we were taught in school) the pen rests between your thumb and index finger. In both cases, you "pinch" the end of the pen with thumb, index finger, and middle finger. But holding it the standard way, the length of the pen is largely unsupported (and so support has to be provided by "pinching" harder), whereas holding the pen between the middle and index finger provides passive support. From your question, did you always hold a pen between middle and index finger?

johngossman 2y ago

Fwiw...I had no hand problems and excellent handwriting. People used to ask me to transcribe their notes for handouts. And after about age 20, I almost completely abandoned it in favor of keyboards. All to say, your life might not have been any different

cylinder714 2y ago

A couple of thoughts: - I met a clerk at a bakery I frequented (for business, not pleasure) who made a tight fist with a pen whenever she wrote down an order. How do you hold a pen or pencil? I think the ideal is to hold it as lightly as possible with your thumb, fore- and middle fingers. - A fountain pen has the least amount of friction of any writing instrument; I learned to write with one in grade school, and managed to forget it later. But I recently picked up a cheap Zebra V-301 for USD$5 and am trying it again.

kstrauser 2y ago

Same for me. I bought a Lamy Safari fountain pen with a triangular grip that sort of forces me to hold it the “right” way, and it was transformative. What, handwriting can be pain-free? And I don’t have to consciously remember to adjust my grip because it pushes me that way? Miracles! More info here: https://www.themanual.com/culture/different-types-of-pencil-grips/ https://www.themanual.com/culture/different-types-of-pencil-... My hand wants to use the lateral tripod grip by default, leading to me gripping the pen too hard and my hand hurting. The Safari gets me to use the dynamic tripod grip which is vastly more comfortable. They’re both considered “mature” grips, but one is much better for writing lots of text in one sitting.

causality0 2y ago
My grip has always been the dynamic tripod. Never helped.
- kstrauser 2y ago
  Got it. I’m glad I can choose to write short bits of text when I want to, and can use a keyboard for anything nontrivial. Handwriting is easier for me now and yet I’d vastly prefer to type.

bikenaga 2y ago

Years ago in a discussion (here, I think) on fountain pens people were complaining about their hands cramping up when writing. Someone suggested the following: Put the pen between your index and middle fingers. The idea is that the lengths of the fingers provide passive support for the pen on both sides. By restricting the range of motion of the pen sideways, you don't have to exert as much force to control the pen to write. I tried it and it's great --- I haven't done it any other way since. I've learned lots of things reading HN but this might have been the best.

brianush1 2y ago
> Put the pen between your index and middle fingers. I'm genuinely curious, how else could you hold a pen?
- bikenaga 2y ago
  Doing it the "standard" way (at least the way we were taught in school) the pen rests between your thumb and index finger. In both cases, you "pinch" the end of the pen with thumb, index finger, and middle finger. But holding it the standard way, the length of the pen is largely unsupported (and so support has to be provided by "pinching" harder), whereas holding the pen between the middle and index finger provides passive support. From your question, did you always hold a pen between middle and index finger?