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That's something I think the EU got right -- being hard-nosed about true tracking consent requiring a user to receive the same outcome regardless of their choic

by ethbr1 3y ago

That's something I think the EU got right -- being hard-nosed about true tracking consent requiring a user to receive the same outcome regardless of their choice. Anything shy is begging companies to dark-engineer patterns around obtaining it.

nox101 3y ago
The EU didn't get this right - or else they aren't enforcing it. I'm in the EU right now and the crap I see is a popup "We respect your privacy. Us and 352 (not an exaggeration!) of our partners are collecting data on you. Approve or Details?" Pick details and you can spend your time going through the partners https://pasteboard.co/rrL2bpmiE6Zq.png https://pasteboard.co/rrL2bpmiE6Zq.png And most you can't reject Even more hilarious. pageboard itself said 847 partners! https://pasteboard.co/XQHhPzTw42Pv.png https://pasteboard.co/XQHhPzTw42Pv.png
- immibis 3y ago
  This is mostly unenforced, as it WAS ruled that it must be as easy to reject as to accept. However, they're going after "consent to ads or buy a subscription" which I thought was a pretty fair compromise business model.
  - Maarten88 3y ago
    I'm generally okay with Ads, that is fair. But I'm not okay with tracking, consolidating data about me from different sources, analyzing it and selling that. It is too hard to understand how that may impact me and others.
  - ethbr1 3y ago
    Imho, the problem with "consent to ads or buy a subscription" is that it becomes the new CableCARD [0]. I.e. all companies really want to be in the business of tracking customers, because they can repackage derivative products and increase their revenue. So the "subscription" option ends up experiencing a lack of support, mysterious technical issues, underinvestment, etc. End result, customers don't choose it, which businesses use to lobby for further eroding mandates. You can't force a company to provide and support a product they don't want to. You can force them to turn one off. [0] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/CableCARD https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/CableCARD
hdevarajan 3y ago
I don’t think the Eu got it right; crucially they missed requiring these choice points to be automatedly navigable for users (eg “.. and if you must publish the metadata representing the choice architecture this way, use these standard keywords to present options, and must allow users to use automation to make their selection “) The first reg this happens in will I think make billions the world over realize this is what the template of all opt-in online regulation has to be and will hopefully change the world.
- ethbr1 3y ago
  That's a case of the perfect being the enemy of the good. If you boil the lobster all at once, the huge ad industry will ensure such regulation never passes. If you gradually increase regulation, then it stands a change of actually passing, and eventually accomplishes the same goal (even if over a longer timeframe). Getting everyone to agree that a mandatory, regulated prompt is required is step 1.

by ethbr1 3y ago

nox101 3y ago

The EU didn't get this right - or else they aren't enforcing it. I'm in the EU right now and the crap I see is a popup "We respect your privacy. Us and 352 (not an exaggeration!) of our partners are collecting data on you. Approve or Details?" Pick details and you can spend your time going through the partners https://pasteboard.co/rrL2bpmiE6Zq.png https://pasteboard.co/rrL2bpmiE6Zq.png And most you can't reject Even more hilarious. pageboard itself said 847 partners! https://pasteboard.co/XQHhPzTw42Pv.png https://pasteboard.co/XQHhPzTw42Pv.png

immibis 3y ago
This is mostly unenforced, as it WAS ruled that it must be as easy to reject as to accept. However, they're going after "consent to ads or buy a subscription" which I thought was a pretty fair compromise business model.
- Maarten88 3y ago
  I'm generally okay with Ads, that is fair. But I'm not okay with tracking, consolidating data about me from different sources, analyzing it and selling that. It is too hard to understand how that may impact me and others.
- ethbr1 3y ago
  Imho, the problem with "consent to ads or buy a subscription" is that it becomes the new CableCARD [0]. I.e. all companies really want to be in the business of tracking customers, because they can repackage derivative products and increase their revenue. So the "subscription" option ends up experiencing a lack of support, mysterious technical issues, underinvestment, etc. End result, customers don't choose it, which businesses use to lobby for further eroding mandates. You can't force a company to provide and support a product they don't want to. You can force them to turn one off. [0] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/CableCARD https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/CableCARD

hdevarajan 3y ago

I don’t think the Eu got it right; crucially they missed requiring these choice points to be automatedly navigable for users (eg “.. and if you must publish the metadata representing the choice architecture this way, use these standard keywords to present options, and must allow users to use automation to make their selection “) The first reg this happens in will I think make billions the world over realize this is what the template of all opt-in online regulation has to be and will hopefully change the world.

ethbr1 3y ago
That's a case of the perfect being the enemy of the good. If you boil the lobster all at once, the huge ad industry will ensure such regulation never passes. If you gradually increase regulation, then it stands a change of actually passing, and eventually accomplishes the same goal (even if over a longer timeframe). Getting everyone to agree that a mandatory, regulated prompt is required is step 1.