5 ms·

Herb Sutter: Visual C++ for Windows 8

23 points by AndreyKarpov 14y ago

binarycrusader 14y ago
"How much would you pay? But wait there's more. If you act now, and pay only $500, you too will be honoured with the privilege of developing C++11 Applications for Windows 8!" It's hard to take Sutter seriously about Micorosoft's support for C++ when the Visual Studio product management decides that you have to pay for the privilege of developing C++ applications for Windows 8 if you want to use Microsoft's tools.
- iwwr 14y ago
  It's worked so far, hasn't it? And $500 is petty cash in the grand scheme of things (what it costs to actually support a developer).
  - binarycrusader 14y ago
    I'm not sure what you mean by "it's worked so far"; Microsoft has provided C++ compilers freely for around 7+ years now. They have chosen to not do so any longer. Instead, they give you only the tools needed to write Metro applications, which, just coincidentally require you to sell them through their store and can't be side-loaded onto normal systems, and they get a 30% cut. As for "what it actually costs to support a developer" -- you're forgetting about the open source developers and other independents. Unless you're talking about Microsoft's costs, in which case, I could care less. So much for "developers, developers, developers!"
- thebluesky 14y ago
  What we hear: "Dear hobbyist coder. You're not welcome. We only care about developers who have employers willing to pay $500, or just pony up the $500 yourself." Alternatively develop for Linux and other platforms in a language of your choice with a free compiler...
nhebb 14y ago
The more I see of Windows 8, the less I'm convinced businesses will migrate to it. Maybe I'm being too cynical, but I wonder whether the direction taken by Microsoft will spur more businesses to finally migrate from XP to Windows 7 - before it's too late.
- bztzt 14y ago
  FWIW, getting (any sizable % of) businesses to migrate was an explicit non-goal of the Windows 8 project from the beginning.
  - nhebb 14y ago
    Did Ballmer (or other Microsoft exec) address this? If so I'd be curious to read what they said.
    - bztzt 14y ago
      It's not like they're going to go around encouraging businesses not to migrate, but from the start the thinking was that after just moving to W7 they wouldn't want to migrate anyway, that there was little short-term threat from desktop competitors, and that the long-term (or really medium-term) threat was from "consumerization of IT" and employees forming their expectations of how computing should work via iPhone etc. - so they decided W8 should be a heavily consumer-focused release.

23 points by AndreyKarpov 14y ago

"How much would you pay? But wait there's more. If you act now, and pay only $500, you too will be honoured with the privilege of developing C++11 Applications for Windows 8!" It's hard to take Sutter seriously about Micorosoft's support for C++ when the Visual Studio product management decides that you have to pay for the privilege of developing C++ applications for Windows 8 if you want to use Microsoft's tools.

iwwr 14y ago
It's worked so far, hasn't it? And $500 is petty cash in the grand scheme of things (what it costs to actually support a developer).
- binarycrusader 14y ago
  I'm not sure what you mean by "it's worked so far"; Microsoft has provided C++ compilers freely for around 7+ years now. They have chosen to not do so any longer. Instead, they give you only the tools needed to write Metro applications, which, just coincidentally require you to sell them through their store and can't be side-loaded onto normal systems, and they get a 30% cut. As for "what it actually costs to support a developer" -- you're forgetting about the open source developers and other independents. Unless you're talking about Microsoft's costs, in which case, I could care less. So much for "developers, developers, developers!"
thebluesky 14y ago
What we hear: "Dear hobbyist coder. You're not welcome. We only care about developers who have employers willing to pay $500, or just pony up the $500 yourself." Alternatively develop for Linux and other platforms in a language of your choice with a free compiler...

nhebb 14y ago

The more I see of Windows 8, the less I'm convinced businesses will migrate to it. Maybe I'm being too cynical, but I wonder whether the direction taken by Microsoft will spur more businesses to finally migrate from XP to Windows 7 - before it's too late.

bztzt 14y ago
FWIW, getting (any sizable % of) businesses to migrate was an explicit non-goal of the Windows 8 project from the beginning.
- nhebb 14y ago
  Did Ballmer (or other Microsoft exec) address this? If so I'd be curious to read what they said.
  - bztzt 14y ago
    It's not like they're going to go around encouraging businesses not to migrate, but from the start the thinking was that after just moving to W7 they wouldn't want to migrate anyway, that there was little short-term threat from desktop competitors, and that the long-term (or really medium-term) threat was from "consumerization of IT" and employees forming their expectations of how computing should work via iPhone etc. - so they decided W8 should be a heavily consumer-focused release.