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The only thing Apple cares about is Apple making more money. they will gladly gouge the end User so that their executives can line their pockets. there is nobod

The only thing Apple cares about is Apple making more money. they will gladly gouge the end User so that their executives can line their pockets. there is nobody here you can actually ”trust”.

simonh 2y ago
However for Apple to keep making money they need to satisfy their users, so as with all commercial relationships there is a direct commercial incentive that aligns customer and vendor interests. The interesting question is how and why those interests align, and when and where they diverge. The answer to that will be different for different customers, or potential customers. A lot of iPhone customers like me are quite happy with the devices more or less as they are. The vast majority of people complaining about iPhones aren't iPhone customers. Frankly I don't really see why I should care what they think. I'm more sympathetic to actual iPhone customers, or former customers that left, but looking at the numbers satisfaction levels with iPhones are through the roof. This is a teeny tiny proportion of customers. The case for Apple harming the interests of customers directly is super thin. The other main dimension to this is Apple's commercial relations with other companies, mainly app store developers. I'm sympathetic to the idea that such relationships should be regulated to at least some extent. I'm glad controls on links to external payment options are being opened up, and there's pressure towards more equitable revenue structures. I think this is the main area Apple's control of the platform is open to abuse, but IMHO that doesn't extend to third party app stores. The current app store should be properly regulated, I think third party stores are a complete distraction. They'll never take off, and are probably going to be a worse experience for users.
- pompino 2y ago
  Just because I bought an iphone, doesn't mean my interests align with Apple when they price gouge me for extra storage, or when they use child labor, or when they continue to create products which fill up landfills due to their anti-repair stance. Apple will suck up as much money as they can get away with - which is capitalism. I would argue there is no "alignment" of anything here. Its up to each individual to examine the facts, and decide for themselves what their own personal threshold is.
- gumby271 2y ago
  The vast majority of people complaining about Apple aren't Apple customers because they don't agree with Apple's business practices or treatment of customers, I don't think that's surprising or invalidates those opinions. I tend to agree that the focus on "3rd party app stores" is stupid, I'd much rather we force computer vendors to have unlockable bootloader's and focus on consumer rights legislation, ensuring people can own the things they buy.
  - simonh 2y ago
    > The vast majority of people complaining about Apple aren't Apple customers because they don't agree with Apple's business practices or treatment of customers Given that a very large number of these people buy Samsung products of all companies, the idea that they’re avoiding Apple on ethical grounds seems somewhat unlikely.
- Repulsion9513 2y ago
  Satisfying your users - particularly, satisfying them only enough that they don't spend significant effort and money to leave - is an incredibly, laughably low bar.
  - BenFranklin100 2y ago
    It’s dead simple to switch from Apple to Android and vice versa. Or are you trying to say Android is such a significantly more difficult platform that Apple users are too stupid to figure out and thus locked into iOS? Otherwise your argument applies to Android as easily as it does to iOS.
    - Repulsion9513 2y ago
      Dead simple until you consider that you have to (a) buy a new phone (b) transfer all your passkeys (c) transfer all your apps (and find replacements for those that don't exist on both platforms) (d) transfer all your data/log in to all your accounts... etc. It's anything but dead simple. (And I went from Android to Apple back in 2020 and back to Android in 2021. It sucked, both ways.)
      - BenFranklin100 2y ago
        Most people buy a new phone every few years as it is, app passwords are the same between platforms, and the average user only uses about a half dozen apps. No one is locked into iOS nor Android. We are talking about 2-3 hours of effort to switch, hardly a ‘anti-competitive’ burden. Get real.
        ubercow13 2y ago
        If only the DOJ had thought of your idea before they launched the huge antitrust case against Apple! They might have saved themselves so much time!
        BenFranklin100 2y ago
sashank_1509 2y ago
Such a bad take, please go back to Reddit where you might be congratulated for garden variety “everyone else is greedy and evil, but I can see through them and speak truth to power”. People here have higher standards on their takes. If all Apple cared about is making money, would they have spent upwards of 10 Billion+ on an Apple Car only to cancel it later. At its height, Vision Pro R&D cost 2 billion per quarter, yes you read that correctly, almost 25% of their yearly net profits went into development of Vision Pro Alone. Does this sound like gouging the customer to line their executive pockets to you? If Apple executives had lined their pockets, then why is the top Apple Executive only worth 2 Billion when Apple is worth close to 3 Trillion, that is less than 0.1% of Apple’s valuation. Apple’s top executive does not even make it to the world’s top 100 by wealth. Does that not make you think?
- pompino 2y ago
  No thanks, I don't want your fake "higher standards". >Does this sound like gouging the customer to line their executive pockets to you? Yes, it does, when they lobby to fight against right-to-repair. Yes, it does, when they price gouge the customer on storage upgrades. Yes, it does, when they hide defects in their products and push people to buy new products. Yes, it does, when they use child labor.
  - Terretta 2y ago
    “Right to repair” is shallow thinking compared to durability and safety at billion device scale. “Storage upgrades” are shallow thinking compared to reliable unified memory at GPU speed -- again across a billion devices. Both of these benefit more consumers more, and more of the device lifetime, than the rarely applicable supposed harms you cite.
    - pompino 2y ago
      repairing increases its lifetime and prevents things from being dumped into landfills. some of the highest selling products are screen protectors, and cell phone cases. Clearly the consumers don’t believe your argument about durability. They were price gouging even before unified memory so your argument doesn’t really hold water. I am sorry.
BenFranklin100 2y ago
/r/chapotraphouse

The only thing Apple cares about is Apple making more money. they will gladly gouge the end User so that their executives can line their pockets. there is nobody here you can actually ”trust”.

simonh 2y ago

However for Apple to keep making money they need to satisfy their users, so as with all commercial relationships there is a direct commercial incentive that aligns customer and vendor interests. The interesting question is how and why those interests align, and when and where they diverge. The answer to that will be different for different customers, or potential customers. A lot of iPhone customers like me are quite happy with the devices more or less as they are. The vast majority of people complaining about iPhones aren't iPhone customers. Frankly I don't really see why I should care what they think. I'm more sympathetic to actual iPhone customers, or former customers that left, but looking at the numbers satisfaction levels with iPhones are through the roof. This is a teeny tiny proportion of customers. The case for Apple harming the interests of customers directly is super thin. The other main dimension to this is Apple's commercial relations with other companies, mainly app store developers. I'm sympathetic to the idea that such relationships should be regulated to at least some extent. I'm glad controls on links to external payment options are being opened up, and there's pressure towards more equitable revenue structures. I think this is the main area Apple's control of the platform is open to abuse, but IMHO that doesn't extend to third party app stores. The current app store should be properly regulated, I think third party stores are a complete distraction. They'll never take off, and are probably going to be a worse experience for users.

pompino 2y ago
Just because I bought an iphone, doesn't mean my interests align with Apple when they price gouge me for extra storage, or when they use child labor, or when they continue to create products which fill up landfills due to their anti-repair stance. Apple will suck up as much money as they can get away with - which is capitalism. I would argue there is no "alignment" of anything here. Its up to each individual to examine the facts, and decide for themselves what their own personal threshold is.
gumby271 2y ago
The vast majority of people complaining about Apple aren't Apple customers because they don't agree with Apple's business practices or treatment of customers, I don't think that's surprising or invalidates those opinions. I tend to agree that the focus on "3rd party app stores" is stupid, I'd much rather we force computer vendors to have unlockable bootloader's and focus on consumer rights legislation, ensuring people can own the things they buy.
- simonh 2y ago
  > The vast majority of people complaining about Apple aren't Apple customers because they don't agree with Apple's business practices or treatment of customers Given that a very large number of these people buy Samsung products of all companies, the idea that they’re avoiding Apple on ethical grounds seems somewhat unlikely.
Repulsion9513 2y ago
Satisfying your users - particularly, satisfying them only enough that they don't spend significant effort and money to leave - is an incredibly, laughably low bar.
- BenFranklin100 2y ago
  It’s dead simple to switch from Apple to Android and vice versa. Or are you trying to say Android is such a significantly more difficult platform that Apple users are too stupid to figure out and thus locked into iOS? Otherwise your argument applies to Android as easily as it does to iOS.
  - Repulsion9513 2y ago
    Dead simple until you consider that you have to (a) buy a new phone (b) transfer all your passkeys (c) transfer all your apps (and find replacements for those that don't exist on both platforms) (d) transfer all your data/log in to all your accounts... etc. It's anything but dead simple. (And I went from Android to Apple back in 2020 and back to Android in 2021. It sucked, both ways.)
    - BenFranklin100 2y ago
      Most people buy a new phone every few years as it is, app passwords are the same between platforms, and the average user only uses about a half dozen apps. No one is locked into iOS nor Android. We are talking about 2-3 hours of effort to switch, hardly a ‘anti-competitive’ burden. Get real.
      - ubercow13 2y ago
        If only the DOJ had thought of your idea before they launched the huge antitrust case against Apple! They might have saved themselves so much time!
        BenFranklin100 2y ago

sashank_1509 2y ago

Such a bad take, please go back to Reddit where you might be congratulated for garden variety “everyone else is greedy and evil, but I can see through them and speak truth to power”. People here have higher standards on their takes. If all Apple cared about is making money, would they have spent upwards of 10 Billion+ on an Apple Car only to cancel it later. At its height, Vision Pro R&D cost 2 billion per quarter, yes you read that correctly, almost 25% of their yearly net profits went into development of Vision Pro Alone. Does this sound like gouging the customer to line their executive pockets to you? If Apple executives had lined their pockets, then why is the top Apple Executive only worth 2 Billion when Apple is worth close to 3 Trillion, that is less than 0.1% of Apple’s valuation. Apple’s top executive does not even make it to the world’s top 100 by wealth. Does that not make you think?

pompino 2y ago
No thanks, I don't want your fake "higher standards". >Does this sound like gouging the customer to line their executive pockets to you? Yes, it does, when they lobby to fight against right-to-repair. Yes, it does, when they price gouge the customer on storage upgrades. Yes, it does, when they hide defects in their products and push people to buy new products. Yes, it does, when they use child labor.
- Terretta 2y ago
  “Right to repair” is shallow thinking compared to durability and safety at billion device scale. “Storage upgrades” are shallow thinking compared to reliable unified memory at GPU speed -- again across a billion devices. Both of these benefit more consumers more, and more of the device lifetime, than the rarely applicable supposed harms you cite.
  - pompino 2y ago
    repairing increases its lifetime and prevents things from being dumped into landfills. some of the highest selling products are screen protectors, and cell phone cases. Clearly the consumers don’t believe your argument about durability. They were price gouging even before unified memory so your argument doesn’t really hold water. I am sorry.

BenFranklin100 2y ago

/r/chapotraphouse