5 ms·

Columbia University has a doxxing problem

tomohawk 2y ago
It's not doxxing to call out people for their public actions. It's attribution.
- mjfl 2y ago
  it's retribution.
- TOMDM 2y ago
  The first example in the article concerns a student that was attributed as a signatory after a group they no longer attend signed on their behalf. Call it attribution if you want but it's a pretty terrible job of it.
  - tomohawk 2y ago
    [flagged]
- richrichie 2y ago
  [flagged]
racional 2y ago
The doxxing campaign is deplorable and unacceptable on its own terms, of course. However the article mischaracterizes the nature at least of the petitions that some of the students signed, making it out to be more harmless and innocuous than it actually was: Columbia Students for Justice in Palestine published an open letter on Monday demanding the University to “start verbally acknowledging Palestinian existence and humanity.” Whereas actually that open letter was basically a standard piece of atrocity denial -- and in essence, it seems to celebrate the events that had just occurred 48 hours previously. Here's the language it used to describe the Oct 7 pogrom: Despite the odds against them, Palestinians launched a counter-offensive against their settler-colonial oppressor – which receives billions of US dollars annually in military aid and possesses one of the world’s most robust surveillance and security apparatuses. Any omission of this context – any rhetoric of “an unprovoked Palestinian attack” – is shamefully misleading. Which is a nauseatingly stupid and insensitive thing to say right after 700+ civilians had just been butchered, and another 200+ dragged off into tunnels by a certain militant group (whom the type of people who sign such petitions like to affectionately refer to as "the Resistance") can make some kind of a political point. In my view. None of which justifies the doxxing campaign. But there's no need to mince words about the nature of the petition campaigns that preceded it.
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
- jazzyjackson 2y ago
  100% I also couldn't tell if the "doxxed" students were trying to say they were falsely associated with the moment, they just say they didn't personally sign the letter, but the article places them as "involved with the encampment", which to some spectators (myself included) counts as pretty suspect in the "pro resistance" column It's frustrated me too that when I hear about the protests on the news they don't mention the depraved perspective of the organizers of the protest
mjfl 2y ago
I haven't seen a shred of evidence that these protestors are violent, or that they harass members of campuses, as they are said to do. The unbelievably harsh response from the universities and the state, which included forced dispersion by the police, roof snipers at Indiana University, and threats to call in the national guard by the Speaker of the House Mike Johnson at Columbia, has led me to feel incredibly depressed. I feel that we are reaching a schism in the history of the United States, where liberalism is dying and being replaced by... something else.
- zeroonetwothree 2y ago
  Are you familiar with the 1960s? Somehow we survived that without “liberalism dying”.
  - mjfl 2y ago
    that's a pretty terrible example considering the COINTELPRO program with the FBI sending letters to MLK trying to get him to kill himself and assassinating people.
  - nyc_data_geek 2y ago
    This is a false equivalence. Student protesters were far more radical in their actions before force was invoked at that time.
- tomohawk 2y ago
  [flagged]
  - mjfl 2y ago
    That was a hoax, she was brushed by a flag while someone walked past. The fact that you are even using that as evidence shows how weak the case you can make is. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t1nXTlNpNkI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t1nXTlNpNkI
- racional 2y ago
  I haven't seen a shred of evidence that these protestors are violent, or that they harass members of campuses, as they are said to do. Then you need start reading from more diverse sources. Just in the past week, for example - there's Khymani James, still currently front and center within the protest movement at Columbia, who was recorded earlier in the year saying "Zionists don't deserve to live" and "You shouldn't be surprised to see me murdering Zionists": https://www.nytimes.com/2024/04/26/nyregion/columbia-student-protest-zionism.html https://www.nytimes.com/2024/04/26/nyregion/columbia-student... And the assault on Israeli activist Yoseph Haddad by an identified member of the local activist community: https://www.jpost.com/diaspora/antisemitism/article-797910 https://www.jpost.com/diaspora/antisemitism/article-797910 In general the right wing vastly overexaggerates the violent aspects of the protest movement. But beyond question it has its share of assholes.
zeroonetwothree 2y ago
If you participate in a public event you can’t really expect to keep that activity secret. (One could also argue that the fact you want to indicates you feel there is something wrong about your actions) I wouldn’t really say this is doxing, since that usually refers to revealing a private online identity.
- nyc_data_geek 2y ago
  This is an inane argument. If one were to, for example, attend a public protest of Scientology, one might rightly fear for one's safety and be entirely convinced that one is in the right, regardless. Might, or fear thereof, does not make right.
  - deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
  - droopybuns 2y ago
    Not a compelling argument. These people are putting their bodies on the line. It is a public protest. I cannot infer anything other than that they’re willing to risk everything, including their privacy to defend their ideas.
    - deleted 2y ago
      [deleted]
  - phmqk76 2y ago
    I, for one, would like to know who shows up to rallies where they chant “Burn Tel Aviv to the ground!”
- sophacles 2y ago
  Per the article: people who were not involved in any of the protesting and who hadn't made any statements were falsely named as anti-semites. I'd say thats doxxing - what do you call it?
richrichie 2y ago
[flagged]
throwing_away 2y ago
> The student, who did not wish to be identified for fairly obvious reasons, said her name was listed on the truck because a club she was no longer a part of had signed onto an open letter urging Columbia to cut ties with Israel. So she signed an open letter, but didn't want her name to be attached to it? Isn't that the whole point of an open letter? And then she has the opportunity to speak with the press, and asks not to be identified while saying she no longer wants to be associated with the letter? I don't know what's going on with these kids.
- tazu 2y ago
  > I don't know what's going on with these kids. I recommend reading Ted Kaczynski's writing on oversocialization [1]. [1]: https://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/national/longterm/unabomber/manifesto.text.htm https://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/national/longterm/unab...
- Pufferbo 2y ago
  The way I read that was, the club had signed the letter, not her directly.
  - throwing_away 2y ago
    Oh, I read it as the club all signed the letter, and now she's not part of it anymore. Maybe I misread, but if you actually look at the letter, it's a Google form where individuals are encouraged to sign: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1RcXX5DEO3yfJ9R4ksURnzpIPCyVxo575-Y-SoC_vZFk/edit https://docs.google.com/document/d/1RcXX5DEO3yfJ9R4ksURnzpIP...
- sophacles 2y ago
  It's really not that hard to understand: She once was a member of an organization. She left that organization. After she left that organization, the members (no longer including her) signed a letter. She didn't sign it, since she was no longer a member. So how is it OK that she was named as a signatory? I don't know what's going on with people who use the term "these kids".
- deleted 2y ago
ungreased0675 2y ago
The effect of this is going to be employers quietly blackballing all graduates of universities that get into the news for these protests.
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
richrichie 2y ago
[flagged]
- smt88 2y ago
  These kids are anti-Putin, but there's no point in protesting someone who is an enemy of the US (at least as long as Trump is out of office). The protests aren't just generic anti-war stuff. They're specifically against US support for the war.
  - richrichie 2y ago
    [flagged]
    - moshun 2y ago
      [flagged]
      - richrichie 2y ago
        [flagged]
        smt88 2y ago
        > He did nothing about the BLM and Antifa riots. I suspect you don't actually care about being factual, but on the off chance that you do, Trump: - tear-gassed protestors[1][2] to clear them out for a photo-op - used the National Guard against BLM protestors[3] - threatened to personally use the military against protestors unless governors acted themselves (which they largely did) [4] 1. https://www.npr.org/2020/06/01/867532070/trumps-unannounced-church-visit-angers-church-officials https://www.npr.org/2020/06/01/867532070/trumps-unannounced-... 2. https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/national-guard-troops-deployed-white-house-trump-calls/story?id=71004151 https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/national-guard-troops-deploy... 3. https://www.nbcnews.com/think/opinion/trump-barr-used-loophole-deploy-national-guard-u-s-cities-ncna1236034 https://www.nbcnews.com/think/opinion/trump-barr-used-loopho... 4. https://apnews.com/article/mo-state-wire-in-state-wire-mi-state-wire-election-2020-virus-outbreak-a2797b342b4fc509e43f404817a56aa9 https://apnews.com/article/mo-state-wire-in-state-wire-mi-st...
Simulacra 2y ago
If you are in public you have no right to privacy, especially if you break laws and misbehave. This has been exhaustively debated, The Verge should know better.

It's not doxxing to call out people for their public actions. It's attribution.

mjfl 2y ago
it's retribution.
TOMDM 2y ago
The first example in the article concerns a student that was attributed as a signatory after a group they no longer attend signed on their behalf. Call it attribution if you want but it's a pretty terrible job of it.
- tomohawk 2y ago
  [flagged]
richrichie 2y ago
[flagged]

The doxxing campaign is deplorable and unacceptable on its own terms, of course. However the article mischaracterizes the nature at least of the petitions that some of the students signed, making it out to be more harmless and innocuous than it actually was: Columbia Students for Justice in Palestine published an open letter on Monday demanding the University to “start verbally acknowledging Palestinian existence and humanity.” Whereas actually that open letter was basically a standard piece of atrocity denial -- and in essence, it seems to celebrate the events that had just occurred 48 hours previously. Here's the language it used to describe the Oct 7 pogrom: Despite the odds against them, Palestinians launched a counter-offensive against their settler-colonial oppressor – which receives billions of US dollars annually in military aid and possesses one of the world’s most robust surveillance and security apparatuses. Any omission of this context – any rhetoric of “an unprovoked Palestinian attack” – is shamefully misleading. Which is a nauseatingly stupid and insensitive thing to say right after 700+ civilians had just been butchered, and another 200+ dragged off into tunnels by a certain militant group (whom the type of people who sign such petitions like to affectionately refer to as "the Resistance") can make some kind of a political point. In my view. None of which justifies the doxxing campaign. But there's no need to mince words about the nature of the petition campaigns that preceded it.

deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
jazzyjackson 2y ago
100% I also couldn't tell if the "doxxed" students were trying to say they were falsely associated with the moment, they just say they didn't personally sign the letter, but the article places them as "involved with the encampment", which to some spectators (myself included) counts as pretty suspect in the "pro resistance" column It's frustrated me too that when I hear about the protests on the news they don't mention the depraved perspective of the organizers of the protest

mjfl 2y ago

I haven't seen a shred of evidence that these protestors are violent, or that they harass members of campuses, as they are said to do. The unbelievably harsh response from the universities and the state, which included forced dispersion by the police, roof snipers at Indiana University, and threats to call in the national guard by the Speaker of the House Mike Johnson at Columbia, has led me to feel incredibly depressed. I feel that we are reaching a schism in the history of the United States, where liberalism is dying and being replaced by... something else.

zeroonetwothree 2y ago
Are you familiar with the 1960s? Somehow we survived that without “liberalism dying”.
- mjfl 2y ago
  that's a pretty terrible example considering the COINTELPRO program with the FBI sending letters to MLK trying to get him to kill himself and assassinating people.
- nyc_data_geek 2y ago
  This is a false equivalence. Student protesters were far more radical in their actions before force was invoked at that time.
tomohawk 2y ago
[flagged]
- mjfl 2y ago
  That was a hoax, she was brushed by a flag while someone walked past. The fact that you are even using that as evidence shows how weak the case you can make is. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t1nXTlNpNkI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t1nXTlNpNkI
racional 2y ago
I haven't seen a shred of evidence that these protestors are violent, or that they harass members of campuses, as they are said to do. Then you need start reading from more diverse sources. Just in the past week, for example - there's Khymani James, still currently front and center within the protest movement at Columbia, who was recorded earlier in the year saying "Zionists don't deserve to live" and "You shouldn't be surprised to see me murdering Zionists": https://www.nytimes.com/2024/04/26/nyregion/columbia-student-protest-zionism.html https://www.nytimes.com/2024/04/26/nyregion/columbia-student... And the assault on Israeli activist Yoseph Haddad by an identified member of the local activist community: https://www.jpost.com/diaspora/antisemitism/article-797910 https://www.jpost.com/diaspora/antisemitism/article-797910 In general the right wing vastly overexaggerates the violent aspects of the protest movement. But beyond question it has its share of assholes.

zeroonetwothree 2y ago

If you participate in a public event you can’t really expect to keep that activity secret. (One could also argue that the fact you want to indicates you feel there is something wrong about your actions) I wouldn’t really say this is doxing, since that usually refers to revealing a private online identity.

nyc_data_geek 2y ago
This is an inane argument. If one were to, for example, attend a public protest of Scientology, one might rightly fear for one's safety and be entirely convinced that one is in the right, regardless. Might, or fear thereof, does not make right.
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
- droopybuns 2y ago
  Not a compelling argument. These people are putting their bodies on the line. It is a public protest. I cannot infer anything other than that they’re willing to risk everything, including their privacy to defend their ideas.
  - deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
- phmqk76 2y ago
  I, for one, would like to know who shows up to rallies where they chant “Burn Tel Aviv to the ground!”
sophacles 2y ago
Per the article: people who were not involved in any of the protesting and who hadn't made any statements were falsely named as anti-semites. I'd say thats doxxing - what do you call it?

richrichie 2y ago

[flagged]

throwing_away 2y ago

> The student, who did not wish to be identified for fairly obvious reasons, said her name was listed on the truck because a club she was no longer a part of had signed onto an open letter urging Columbia to cut ties with Israel. So she signed an open letter, but didn't want her name to be attached to it? Isn't that the whole point of an open letter? And then she has the opportunity to speak with the press, and asks not to be identified while saying she no longer wants to be associated with the letter? I don't know what's going on with these kids.

tazu 2y ago
> I don't know what's going on with these kids. I recommend reading Ted Kaczynski's writing on oversocialization [1]. [1]: https://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/national/longterm/unabomber/manifesto.text.htm https://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/national/longterm/unab...
Pufferbo 2y ago
The way I read that was, the club had signed the letter, not her directly.
- throwing_away 2y ago
  Oh, I read it as the club all signed the letter, and now she's not part of it anymore. Maybe I misread, but if you actually look at the letter, it's a Google form where individuals are encouraged to sign: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1RcXX5DEO3yfJ9R4ksURnzpIPCyVxo575-Y-SoC_vZFk/edit https://docs.google.com/document/d/1RcXX5DEO3yfJ9R4ksURnzpIP...
sophacles 2y ago
It's really not that hard to understand: She once was a member of an organization. She left that organization. After she left that organization, the members (no longer including her) signed a letter. She didn't sign it, since she was no longer a member. So how is it OK that she was named as a signatory? I don't know what's going on with people who use the term "these kids".
deleted 2y ago

ungreased0675 2y ago

The effect of this is going to be employers quietly blackballing all graduates of universities that get into the news for these protests.

deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]

richrichie 2y ago

[flagged]

smt88 2y ago
These kids are anti-Putin, but there's no point in protesting someone who is an enemy of the US (at least as long as Trump is out of office). The protests aren't just generic anti-war stuff. They're specifically against US support for the war.
- richrichie 2y ago
  [flagged]
  - moshun 2y ago
    [flagged]
    - richrichie 2y ago
      [flagged]
      - smt88 2y ago
        > He did nothing about the BLM and Antifa riots. I suspect you don't actually care about being factual, but on the off chance that you do, Trump: - tear-gassed protestors[1][2] to clear them out for a photo-op - used the National Guard against BLM protestors[3] - threatened to personally use the military against protestors unless governors acted themselves (which they largely did) [4] 1. https://www.npr.org/2020/06/01/867532070/trumps-unannounced-church-visit-angers-church-officials https://www.npr.org/2020/06/01/867532070/trumps-unannounced-... 2. https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/national-guard-troops-deployed-white-house-trump-calls/story?id=71004151 https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/national-guard-troops-deploy... 3. https://www.nbcnews.com/think/opinion/trump-barr-used-loophole-deploy-national-guard-u-s-cities-ncna1236034 https://www.nbcnews.com/think/opinion/trump-barr-used-loopho... 4. https://apnews.com/article/mo-state-wire-in-state-wire-mi-state-wire-election-2020-virus-outbreak-a2797b342b4fc509e43f404817a56aa9 https://apnews.com/article/mo-state-wire-in-state-wire-mi-st...

Simulacra 2y ago

If you are in public you have no right to privacy, especially if you break laws and misbehave. This has been exhaustively debated, The Verge should know better.