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The Rust community is one of the top arguments against rust. I've never before been so condescended to as when attempting to ask questions there. Their lack of

The Rust community is one of the top arguments against rust. I've never before been so condescended to as when attempting to ask questions there. Their lack of care for perf also drives me up a wall. Anytime they propose adding an extra layer of indirection to get around the borrow checker, I have to explain yet again that with the way modern CPUs work, extra layers of indirection have serious cache-related perf costs. Then I get told that I am yet again doing it wrong, computers are fast enough, and I am worrying about the wrong thing.

JoshTriplett 3y ago
> when attempting to ask questions there Could you please give an indication of which venues you've encountered this kind of condescension in? I don't tend to see this in the spaces I frequent, but I know it is happening, and I wish it weren't. We try, sometimes, to provide some official messaging discouraging this kind of condescension, but perhaps there's something more we can do.
- mrkeen 3y ago
  I think I found it: >> Their lack of care for perf >> I have to explain yet again
  - LocalGauge 3y ago
    My understanding is that he rather asked for specific examples (maybe post on reddit, rustlang forum), maybe I am wrong. I think giving actual examples would be more beneficial so we see the actual context clearly.
- gg2222 3y ago
  In my view, here's an example from this HN comment section: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40177534 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40177534 If this is the kind of attitude I would get from using Rust and having to be part of the Rust community, then I think I will pass.
- hu3 3y ago
  I don't do this usually because it's not constructive and incites flamewars, but since it was asked, this is whats 5 minutes of browsing comments got me. 1) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40175427 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40175427 Implies OP doesn't care about programming: > The vibe that I'm getting is that it's filled with people that don't particularly care about programming, they just want to get stuff done(TM), this is also highlighted by the fact that they are willing to write completely inadequate code just to see things working. Rust is not that, and that's a good thing. 2) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40173609 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40173609 Handwaves Rust's complicated and onging async history and pinpoints the problem to "this guy": > Why is async such a dealbreaker for this guy? Especially for web dev. 3) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40172636 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40172636 Another "you're holding it wrong": > That has got to be the most "I didn't think this through" take ever. 4) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40172605 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40172605 As a newcomer, not thinking the Rust way is a sin and if you ask dumb questions you deserve retaliation, apparenlty: > "On the other hand, Rust communities are inundated with people trying to write Rust as if it was their old favorite language..." > "..In my experience, Rust community members who arrive with well thought out complaints or suggestions are welcomed by the people who like working on programming language fundamentals." 5) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40172883 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40172883 More handwaving of Rusts shortcomings. Plus contradiction on the same sentence: > "Rust is not antithetical to iteration-based programming, it just makes you write a lot of heavy boilerplate to explicitly support that kind of style."
hot_gril 3y ago
Many of us have probably heard that all the dumb programmers use Javascript, but even if that's true, that's a reason for me to use it. Even though I'm capable of using galaxy-brained language ecosystems, I don't need that mental overhead. And if it'll be cheaper to hire JS programmers onto the team, great.

JoshTriplett 3y ago

> when attempting to ask questions there Could you please give an indication of which venues you've encountered this kind of condescension in? I don't tend to see this in the spaces I frequent, but I know it is happening, and I wish it weren't. We try, sometimes, to provide some official messaging discouraging this kind of condescension, but perhaps there's something more we can do.

mrkeen 3y ago
I think I found it: >> Their lack of care for perf >> I have to explain yet again
- LocalGauge 3y ago
  My understanding is that he rather asked for specific examples (maybe post on reddit, rustlang forum), maybe I am wrong. I think giving actual examples would be more beneficial so we see the actual context clearly.
gg2222 3y ago
In my view, here's an example from this HN comment section: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40177534 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40177534 If this is the kind of attitude I would get from using Rust and having to be part of the Rust community, then I think I will pass.
hu3 3y ago
I don't do this usually because it's not constructive and incites flamewars, but since it was asked, this is whats 5 minutes of browsing comments got me. 1) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40175427 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40175427 Implies OP doesn't care about programming: > The vibe that I'm getting is that it's filled with people that don't particularly care about programming, they just want to get stuff done(TM), this is also highlighted by the fact that they are willing to write completely inadequate code just to see things working. Rust is not that, and that's a good thing. 2) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40173609 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40173609 Handwaves Rust's complicated and onging async history and pinpoints the problem to "this guy": > Why is async such a dealbreaker for this guy? Especially for web dev. 3) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40172636 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40172636 Another "you're holding it wrong": > That has got to be the most "I didn't think this through" take ever. 4) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40172605 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40172605 As a newcomer, not thinking the Rust way is a sin and if you ask dumb questions you deserve retaliation, apparenlty: > "On the other hand, Rust communities are inundated with people trying to write Rust as if it was their old favorite language..." > "..In my experience, Rust community members who arrive with well thought out complaints or suggestions are welcomed by the people who like working on programming language fundamentals." 5) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40172883 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40172883 More handwaving of Rusts shortcomings. Plus contradiction on the same sentence: > "Rust is not antithetical to iteration-based programming, it just makes you write a lot of heavy boilerplate to explicitly support that kind of style."

hot_gril 3y ago

Many of us have probably heard that all the dumb programmers use Javascript, but even if that's true, that's a reason for me to use it. Even though I'm capable of using galaxy-brained language ecosystems, I don't need that mental overhead. And if it'll be cheaper to hire JS programmers onto the team, great.