3 ms·

Do you know the name of the company that produces the EUV machine? is it ASML? It is my understanding that only ASML had cracked the EUV litography, but if the

Do you know the name of the company that produces the EUV machine? is it ASML? It is my understanding that only ASML had cracked the EUV litography, but if there's another company out there, that would be an interesting development to watch.

singhrac 2y ago
It’s ASML.
Rinzler89 2y ago
>It is my understanding that only ASML had cracked the EUV litography Ackshually, EUV was cracked by Sandia Labs research in the US, with EUV light sources built by Cymer in the US. ASML was the only one allowed to license the tech and integrate it into their steppers after they bough Cymer in 2013. Hence why US has veto rights to whom Dutch based ASML can sell their EUV steppers to, as in not to China, despite ow much ASML shareholders would like that extra Chinese money.
- ano-ther 2y ago
  More on the history here: https://www.asml.com/en/news/stories/2022/making-euv-lab-to-fab https://www.asml.com/en/news/stories/2022/making-euv-lab-to-...
  - EMCymatics 2y ago
    Thanks for the source. I'm glad Bell labs pounced on the opportunity.
  - oivey 2y ago
    Pretty cool story of the National Lab system and the closest thing the US has to “government scientists” massively shaping the future.
- s3p 2y ago
  They don't need anyone else's money. Intel has bought all of TSMC's EUV and High-NA EUV machines for the next several years.
  - Rinzler89 2y ago
    >They don't need anyone else's money There's no such thing in capitalism. Limited supply semi is(was) a bidding war, where China had a blank cheque and was willing to outbid everyone else to secure semi manufacturing supremacy. Do you think Intel or TSMC could have scored all that ASML supply at that price if China would have been allowed to bid as well? ASML would have been able to score way higher market prices per EUV stepper had China been allowed in the game, and therefore higher profits. You think ASML shareholders hate higher profits or what? Nvidia sure didn't during the pandemic. You wanted a GPU? Great, it would cost you now 2x-3x the original MSRP because free market capitalism and the laws of supply and demand.
- saganus 2y ago
  Did not know that. Thanks
- ahartmetz 2y ago
  >EUV was cracked More like it was started. There were a ton of gnarly problems left that took over ten years and billions of € to solve. Producing a few flashes of EUV and getting a few photons on the target is relatively easy. Producing a lot of EUV for a long time and getting a significant fraction (...like 1%) of the photons on the target is very hard.
  - hajile 2y ago
    EUV was supposed to ship in the early 2000s and the work on it started in earnest the 90s. It turned out that EUV is way harder than anyone imagined. The only reason we did stuff like immersion DUV was because we couldn’t get EUV to work.
nabla9 2y ago
Yes, and Intel was the first to install the first High-NA EUV machine from ASML, TWINSCAN EXE:5000 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3PCtf1ONYMU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3PCtf1ONYMU ps. Intel used to own 15% of ASML in 2012, now they own less than 2%.

singhrac 2y ago

It’s ASML.

Rinzler89 2y ago

>It is my understanding that only ASML had cracked the EUV litography Ackshually, EUV was cracked by Sandia Labs research in the US, with EUV light sources built by Cymer in the US. ASML was the only one allowed to license the tech and integrate it into their steppers after they bough Cymer in 2013. Hence why US has veto rights to whom Dutch based ASML can sell their EUV steppers to, as in not to China, despite ow much ASML shareholders would like that extra Chinese money.

ano-ther 2y ago
More on the history here: https://www.asml.com/en/news/stories/2022/making-euv-lab-to-fab https://www.asml.com/en/news/stories/2022/making-euv-lab-to-...
- EMCymatics 2y ago
  Thanks for the source. I'm glad Bell labs pounced on the opportunity.
- oivey 2y ago
  Pretty cool story of the National Lab system and the closest thing the US has to “government scientists” massively shaping the future.
s3p 2y ago
They don't need anyone else's money. Intel has bought all of TSMC's EUV and High-NA EUV machines for the next several years.
- Rinzler89 2y ago
  >They don't need anyone else's money There's no such thing in capitalism. Limited supply semi is(was) a bidding war, where China had a blank cheque and was willing to outbid everyone else to secure semi manufacturing supremacy. Do you think Intel or TSMC could have scored all that ASML supply at that price if China would have been allowed to bid as well? ASML would have been able to score way higher market prices per EUV stepper had China been allowed in the game, and therefore higher profits. You think ASML shareholders hate higher profits or what? Nvidia sure didn't during the pandemic. You wanted a GPU? Great, it would cost you now 2x-3x the original MSRP because free market capitalism and the laws of supply and demand.
saganus 2y ago
Did not know that. Thanks
ahartmetz 2y ago
>EUV was cracked More like it was started. There were a ton of gnarly problems left that took over ten years and billions of € to solve. Producing a few flashes of EUV and getting a few photons on the target is relatively easy. Producing a lot of EUV for a long time and getting a significant fraction (...like 1%) of the photons on the target is very hard.
- hajile 2y ago
  EUV was supposed to ship in the early 2000s and the work on it started in earnest the 90s. It turned out that EUV is way harder than anyone imagined. The only reason we did stuff like immersion DUV was because we couldn’t get EUV to work.

nabla9 2y ago

Yes, and Intel was the first to install the first High-NA EUV machine from ASML, TWINSCAN EXE:5000 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3PCtf1ONYMU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3PCtf1ONYMU ps. Intel used to own 15% of ASML in 2012, now they own less than 2%.