3 ms·

> The web is for documents. It's just de facto not any more, sorry. You can be a maximalist all you want, you're achieving nothing and nobody cares. You're not

> The web is for documents. It's just de facto not any more, sorry. You can be a maximalist all you want, you're achieving nothing and nobody cares. You're not hip. Do you know many users of my application care that it doesn't work without JS? Precisely none. My revenue would grow literally 0% if I went through this effort, and I would have a much worse application at the end of it.

cedilla 3y ago
Even the part of the web that is all about documents is much better with JS than without. I enjoy reading articles with pictures I can enlarge. I enjoy having wikilinks that open a little preview of the target article on hover. And it's very useful to be able to add documents to a list with a single click. Probably not possible as seamless on the server-side, and I really don't need a server-roundtrip plus repaint just for that. I remember when all that was done server-side. And I remember having bespoke apps to interact with everything. It was horrible. Yeah, the rant dates the person pretty well - not old enough to remember having to download some platform specific .exe shipping some Java nonsense that somehow depends on having IE6 just to order computer parts from a supplier. Yes, it was a smaller download than just the same supplier's homepage is today, but it was just horrible to work with. I'll take the 60 MB of JS frameworks any day.
- solumunus 3y ago
  > I remember when all that was done server-side. And I remember having bespoke apps to interact with everything. It was horrible. Exactly. I'm starting to believe that a lot of these HTML only maximalists are newer developers, who think it's some kind of trendy, retro badge of honour to reject JS. Yes, there are some messy, bloated JS web site these days, but if you think we haven't progressed from web 1.0 I have to question whether you ever actually experienced web 1.0.
- crtasm 3y ago
  >I enjoy reading articles with pictures I can enlarge. It's so frequent that I click to enlarge and the loaded image is displayed at a smaller, or about the same size due to the formatting around it. For truly huge images with lots of detail to inspect a zoom and pan interface can be useful, but for most please just give me a link to open the image file directly - I will choose if I want that to happen in the same tab or a new one.
xigoi 3y ago
I bet a non-zero amount of your users care whether it takes a few milliseconds or several seconds to load a page on your website.

cedilla 3y ago

Even the part of the web that is all about documents is much better with JS than without. I enjoy reading articles with pictures I can enlarge. I enjoy having wikilinks that open a little preview of the target article on hover. And it's very useful to be able to add documents to a list with a single click. Probably not possible as seamless on the server-side, and I really don't need a server-roundtrip plus repaint just for that. I remember when all that was done server-side. And I remember having bespoke apps to interact with everything. It was horrible. Yeah, the rant dates the person pretty well - not old enough to remember having to download some platform specific .exe shipping some Java nonsense that somehow depends on having IE6 just to order computer parts from a supplier. Yes, it was a smaller download than just the same supplier's homepage is today, but it was just horrible to work with. I'll take the 60 MB of JS frameworks any day.

solumunus 3y ago
> I remember when all that was done server-side. And I remember having bespoke apps to interact with everything. It was horrible. Exactly. I'm starting to believe that a lot of these HTML only maximalists are newer developers, who think it's some kind of trendy, retro badge of honour to reject JS. Yes, there are some messy, bloated JS web site these days, but if you think we haven't progressed from web 1.0 I have to question whether you ever actually experienced web 1.0.
crtasm 3y ago
>I enjoy reading articles with pictures I can enlarge. It's so frequent that I click to enlarge and the loaded image is displayed at a smaller, or about the same size due to the formatting around it. For truly huge images with lots of detail to inspect a zoom and pan interface can be useful, but for most please just give me a link to open the image file directly - I will choose if I want that to happen in the same tab or a new one.

xigoi 3y ago

I bet a non-zero amount of your users care whether it takes a few milliseconds or several seconds to load a page on your website.