3 ms·

Without advertising in the world, it'd be a much poorer place. Advertising exists for more than a thousand years and it's the only way for other people to know

by vasco 3y ago

Without advertising in the world, it'd be a much poorer place. Advertising exists for more than a thousand years and it's the only way for other people to know what you can do for them in exchange for something.

csomar 3y ago
Except the advertising industry of today is akin to mental manipulation. It's less about letting you know what the product can do for you and more about getting you to buy/pay for it.
blackbear_ 3y ago
I call what you are describing "informational" advertisement, and indeed it is totally fine. However most modern advertisement is not trying to inform but rather to convince, using a variety of psychological tricks to manipulate viewers into a specific position. This is totally not okay.
pyinstallwoes 3y ago
I'm sorry but that's bullshit. Advertising is carte blanche mind control. Markets and products can easily exist without advertising. In fact, they're better. You go to markets, and you have curators. Advertising outside of a market should be not only illegal but culturally frowned upon as a root ethic.
- vasco 3y ago
  > Markets and products can easily exist without advertising Source needed - seeing I don't know any company that doesn't advertise in some shape or form. The ones that I found that claim they don't, actually do advertise and use the "we don't advertise" as further advertisements. By definition I think it'd be hard to find companies that truly don't advertise, so maybe you know of some that are successful but don't do it?
  - Zambyte 3y ago
    I'm not a fan of Tesla but to give credit where it's due, I have never seen an advertisement from them. The closest thing I have seen is branded chargers, which is also a functional display of their brand (you need to know if you can use the charger or not). There are also tons of small companies that have no advertising. Think one or few man shows that operate on word of mouth, and are not looking to grow.
    - vasco 3y ago
      What would you consider Elon's constant posting about Tesla on social media qualify as?
      - pyinstallwoes 3y ago
        Not marketing/advertisement.
  - pyinstallwoes 3y ago
    Source: history.
Terr_ 3y ago
It's easy to make a strong argument when it's also woefully incomplete. :P If all advertising were just abstract economic information that a service or product existed with certain features at a certain price-point, then we're left with a whole bunch of inexplicable mysteries, including-but-not-limited-to: * Why would there be some expensive messages that lack any of that economic information, such as those which show a succession of nice things (that aren't being sold) closing with a brand-name the viewer is already aware of? * Why would senders deliberately seek to ensure that the same person sees the same repeated message multiple times, even after they declined to purchase the first time and their situation wouldn't have changed? * Why would any info-packets be crafted to make previously-neutral viewers experience fresh fear and dissatisfaction? * Why would someone spend unnecessary money on funny mascots or catchy music? * Why would (where not illegal) the product have a time-limited discount that wasn't actually time limited nor discounted?
- vasco 3y ago
  You can answer all the questions with the same answer (quoted from my comment above): > Advertising exists (..) for other people to know what you can do for them in exchange for something. Your questions are just requiring more sophisticated answers that will all boil down to that. What you say is "unnecessary funny mascots or catchy music" is brand awareness which is still "letting other people know I exist and I can sell them stuff - I hope they look me up later or remember me when they are at the shop". The others are similar. One might have distaste for the manipulation but then your problem is with people, not advertising. A slimey sales guy does as much or more manipulation without needing to buy ads.
  - Ghexor 3y ago
    I agree that a good salesperson manipulates people too. Instead of trying to compare how much manipulation is done by salespeople vs in ads, I think it's worthwhile to consider how the manipulation is performed. Both ad and salesperson will probably attempt to make us feel some emotion - best case without our conscious awareness of it. The tools an expensive ad has at its disposal seem to me much more effective in evoking emotion; visual stimuli, carefully crafted music, decades of psychology research, etc. And while we've had a chance to evolve strategies against human to human manipulation (doors, perhaps, and various subtle triggers of distrust), the ad environment is a very recent development.

by vasco 3y ago

csomar 3y ago

Except the advertising industry of today is akin to mental manipulation. It's less about letting you know what the product can do for you and more about getting you to buy/pay for it.

blackbear_ 3y ago

I call what you are describing "informational" advertisement, and indeed it is totally fine. However most modern advertisement is not trying to inform but rather to convince, using a variety of psychological tricks to manipulate viewers into a specific position. This is totally not okay.

pyinstallwoes 3y ago

I'm sorry but that's bullshit. Advertising is carte blanche mind control. Markets and products can easily exist without advertising. In fact, they're better. You go to markets, and you have curators. Advertising outside of a market should be not only illegal but culturally frowned upon as a root ethic.

vasco 3y ago
> Markets and products can easily exist without advertising Source needed - seeing I don't know any company that doesn't advertise in some shape or form. The ones that I found that claim they don't, actually do advertise and use the "we don't advertise" as further advertisements. By definition I think it'd be hard to find companies that truly don't advertise, so maybe you know of some that are successful but don't do it?
- Zambyte 3y ago
  I'm not a fan of Tesla but to give credit where it's due, I have never seen an advertisement from them. The closest thing I have seen is branded chargers, which is also a functional display of their brand (you need to know if you can use the charger or not). There are also tons of small companies that have no advertising. Think one or few man shows that operate on word of mouth, and are not looking to grow.
  - vasco 3y ago
    What would you consider Elon's constant posting about Tesla on social media qualify as?
    - pyinstallwoes 3y ago
      Not marketing/advertisement.
- pyinstallwoes 3y ago
  Source: history.

Terr_ 3y ago

It's easy to make a strong argument when it's also woefully incomplete. :P If all advertising were just abstract economic information that a service or product existed with certain features at a certain price-point, then we're left with a whole bunch of inexplicable mysteries, including-but-not-limited-to: * Why would there be some expensive messages that lack any of that economic information, such as those which show a succession of nice things (that aren't being sold) closing with a brand-name the viewer is already aware of? * Why would senders deliberately seek to ensure that the same person sees the same repeated message multiple times, even after they declined to purchase the first time and their situation wouldn't have changed? * Why would any info-packets be crafted to make previously-neutral viewers experience fresh fear and dissatisfaction? * Why would someone spend unnecessary money on funny mascots or catchy music? * Why would (where not illegal) the product have a time-limited discount that wasn't actually time limited nor discounted?

vasco 3y ago
You can answer all the questions with the same answer (quoted from my comment above): > Advertising exists (..) for other people to know what you can do for them in exchange for something. Your questions are just requiring more sophisticated answers that will all boil down to that. What you say is "unnecessary funny mascots or catchy music" is brand awareness which is still "letting other people know I exist and I can sell them stuff - I hope they look me up later or remember me when they are at the shop". The others are similar. One might have distaste for the manipulation but then your problem is with people, not advertising. A slimey sales guy does as much or more manipulation without needing to buy ads.
- Ghexor 3y ago
  I agree that a good salesperson manipulates people too. Instead of trying to compare how much manipulation is done by salespeople vs in ads, I think it's worthwhile to consider how the manipulation is performed. Both ad and salesperson will probably attempt to make us feel some emotion - best case without our conscious awareness of it. The tools an expensive ad has at its disposal seem to me much more effective in evoking emotion; visual stimuli, carefully crafted music, decades of psychology research, etc. And while we've had a chance to evolve strategies against human to human manipulation (doors, perhaps, and various subtle triggers of distrust), the ad environment is a very recent development.