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Sorry you got downvoted to oblivion, but it is to be expected. It's taboo around these parts to question if PJ gets paid for her efforts. However, it's totally

Sorry you got downvoted to oblivion, but it is to be expected. It's taboo around these parts to question if PJ gets paid for her efforts. However, it's totally acceptable and in fact expected to probe deep into sources of funding for people who dare to argue on the other side of the fence. (In fact, PJ does that in this very article.) All this while we don't even know for sure if PJ is a real person and not a pen name used by the Google/IBM legal teams.

jrockway 14y ago
What difference does it make? She's not the judge or jury, so she can be as biased as she wants. It's a blog. Who cares who is paying for it?
- cooldeal 14y ago
  It makes a lot of difference, see how Florian gets treated by the crowd around here(not to mention the jabs at him in the article linked), in spite of coming clean about his affiliations with Oracle. There's a big perception by many here that PJ is impartial and independent, and a disclosure by PJ will show whether that's justified or not.
  - Karunamon 14y ago
    >There's a big perception by many here that PJ is impartial and independent, and a disclosure by PJ will show whether that's justified or not. And? Either his data is correct and forthright or incorrect and misleading. It's quite possible to be biased as fuck and still report objective fact. Until such time as the data skews, I don't particularly care what flag he flies.
    - cooldeal 14y ago
      Then why is the article and people here making such a big deal about Florian then?
      - jrockway 14y ago
        His writing style tends to conflate facts and opinions moreso than PJ's does. He also sounds like a troll. The "we don't like this person" heuristic has been activated, and the fact that he's paid by Oracle is irrelevant.
      - roguecoder 14y ago
        He is A) wrong and B) profits from being wrong by taking money from the people he is writing falsehoods about and C) tried to hide this astroturfing. It may not be "murderer" or "child molester" evil, but it's still pretty unethical and it's unethical behavior done in the name of "FOSS". We have a right and responsibility to police our own.
  - nknight 14y ago
    What disclosure do you want, exactly? Bank records? Travel history? Phone records? Florian's hand was ultimately forced because it is impractical to keep consulting for multiple large companies a secret. So far, no one has ever found any evidence that PJ is anything other than what she says she is -- a Linux user and former paralegal. Even when Maureen O'Gara thought it'd be a good idea to stalk her and publish everything to the world, no evidence of any kind came to light. You are proposing a criminal (yes, criminal, perjury is a crime, and sworn statements as to PJ's lack of involvement with IBM were filed in the SCO case) conspiracy spanning at least multiple large public companies, a well-known law professor, and several prominent tech journalists.
    - Natsu 14y ago
      Presumably, they would like to know which law firm employs her. That is relevant information, though I suspect she knows better than to cover cases her firm participates in after what happened when the Patent Troll Tracker was outed as a Cisco lawyer. He was an honest fellow who got hit with a bunch of lawsuits from a troll who didn't like being called a troll and ended up in a mess because he commented on a case he was a party to and ended up resigning. He was outed after a troll put a bounty on his identity, no less.
      - nknight 14y ago
        Why do you think she's employed by any law firm? She's a former paralegal, not a current paralegal.
        Natsu 14y ago
        Can you cite a source on that? I wasn't aware of her being retired and I find it hard to believe that someone with her skill would be unemployed.
        nknight 14y ago
        I guess my only direct source is that every time she's spoken of working as a paralegal, it's been in the past tense. e.g. her H-Online interview: http://www.h-online.com/open/features/Groklaw-The-blog-that-made-a-difference-1243836.html?view=print http://www.h-online.com/open/features/Groklaw-The-blog-that-... It would certainly have been impractical for long stretches of Groklaw's history for PJ to have a day job.
  - revelation 14y ago
    Because Florian is all opinion, no material. I personally come to Groklaw for the exact and accurate coverage of original sources on these lawsuits, and its easy to ignore the commentary track.
  - wtallis 14y ago
    I don't think anybody is calling PJ impartial - she clearly takes sides. When PJ summarizes things as "Oracle/SCO's case has no merit" and the trial results in a loss for Oracle/SCO, that is evidence that PJ is a good reporter and analyst. It is not evidence of anything fishy about PJ's motives.
  - laconian 14y ago
    http://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/burden-of-proof http://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/burden-of-proof
  - fpgeek 14y ago
    I can't speak for others, but I don't think PJ is impartial or independent. We all know who she's rooting for in these cases and she doesn't try to hide it. The reason PJ is respected here and in other places is because more often than not... she's right (especially from the perspective of helping programmers understand the foreign and alien legal system).
  - zaphar 14y ago
    You completely miss the reasons for our attitudes concerning the two individuals. Florian is consistently wrong in ways that could harm software development. PJ is consistently correct in ways that are good for software development. It has less to do with who pays whom and more to do with who is correct. The distaste is magnified when someone is paid to be wrong but the ultimate source of the distaste that they are wrong.

jrockway 14y ago

What difference does it make? She's not the judge or jury, so she can be as biased as she wants. It's a blog. Who cares who is paying for it?

cooldeal 14y ago
It makes a lot of difference, see how Florian gets treated by the crowd around here(not to mention the jabs at him in the article linked), in spite of coming clean about his affiliations with Oracle. There's a big perception by many here that PJ is impartial and independent, and a disclosure by PJ will show whether that's justified or not.
- Karunamon 14y ago
  >There's a big perception by many here that PJ is impartial and independent, and a disclosure by PJ will show whether that's justified or not. And? Either his data is correct and forthright or incorrect and misleading. It's quite possible to be biased as fuck and still report objective fact. Until such time as the data skews, I don't particularly care what flag he flies.
  - cooldeal 14y ago
    Then why is the article and people here making such a big deal about Florian then?
    - jrockway 14y ago
      His writing style tends to conflate facts and opinions moreso than PJ's does. He also sounds like a troll. The "we don't like this person" heuristic has been activated, and the fact that he's paid by Oracle is irrelevant.
    - roguecoder 14y ago
      He is A) wrong and B) profits from being wrong by taking money from the people he is writing falsehoods about and C) tried to hide this astroturfing. It may not be "murderer" or "child molester" evil, but it's still pretty unethical and it's unethical behavior done in the name of "FOSS". We have a right and responsibility to police our own.
- nknight 14y ago
  What disclosure do you want, exactly? Bank records? Travel history? Phone records? Florian's hand was ultimately forced because it is impractical to keep consulting for multiple large companies a secret. So far, no one has ever found any evidence that PJ is anything other than what she says she is -- a Linux user and former paralegal. Even when Maureen O'Gara thought it'd be a good idea to stalk her and publish everything to the world, no evidence of any kind came to light. You are proposing a criminal (yes, criminal, perjury is a crime, and sworn statements as to PJ's lack of involvement with IBM were filed in the SCO case) conspiracy spanning at least multiple large public companies, a well-known law professor, and several prominent tech journalists.
  - Natsu 14y ago
    Presumably, they would like to know which law firm employs her. That is relevant information, though I suspect she knows better than to cover cases her firm participates in after what happened when the Patent Troll Tracker was outed as a Cisco lawyer. He was an honest fellow who got hit with a bunch of lawsuits from a troll who didn't like being called a troll and ended up in a mess because he commented on a case he was a party to and ended up resigning. He was outed after a troll put a bounty on his identity, no less.
    - nknight 14y ago
      Why do you think she's employed by any law firm? She's a former paralegal, not a current paralegal.
      - Natsu 14y ago
        Can you cite a source on that? I wasn't aware of her being retired and I find it hard to believe that someone with her skill would be unemployed.
        nknight 14y ago
        I guess my only direct source is that every time she's spoken of working as a paralegal, it's been in the past tense. e.g. her H-Online interview: http://www.h-online.com/open/features/Groklaw-The-blog-that-made-a-difference-1243836.html?view=print http://www.h-online.com/open/features/Groklaw-The-blog-that-... It would certainly have been impractical for long stretches of Groklaw's history for PJ to have a day job.
- revelation 14y ago
  Because Florian is all opinion, no material. I personally come to Groklaw for the exact and accurate coverage of original sources on these lawsuits, and its easy to ignore the commentary track.
- wtallis 14y ago
  I don't think anybody is calling PJ impartial - she clearly takes sides. When PJ summarizes things as "Oracle/SCO's case has no merit" and the trial results in a loss for Oracle/SCO, that is evidence that PJ is a good reporter and analyst. It is not evidence of anything fishy about PJ's motives.
- laconian 14y ago
  http://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/burden-of-proof http://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/burden-of-proof
- fpgeek 14y ago
  I can't speak for others, but I don't think PJ is impartial or independent. We all know who she's rooting for in these cases and she doesn't try to hide it. The reason PJ is respected here and in other places is because more often than not... she's right (especially from the perspective of helping programmers understand the foreign and alien legal system).
- zaphar 14y ago
  You completely miss the reasons for our attitudes concerning the two individuals. Florian is consistently wrong in ways that could harm software development. PJ is consistently correct in ways that are good for software development. It has less to do with who pays whom and more to do with who is correct. The distaste is magnified when someone is paid to be wrong but the ultimate source of the distaste that they are wrong.