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see, this is what is great about soft power. If you use it right who is not straight up an enemy will probably give you a lot of leeway as long as mutually bene

see, this is what is great about soft power. If you use it right who is not straight up an enemy will probably give you a lot of leeway as long as mutually beneficial. China is... not doing that. The Tik Tok ban is years late and I don't know why any US citizen could not understand why it's the right thing to do, unless on the payroll of the Chinese government.

autoexec 2y ago
Not on the payroll of the Chinese government here, and I still think it's terrible for congress to tell us what software we're allowed to run on our own devices or to prevent us from accessing media from other countries. If TikTok were breaking US laws and refused to comply that'd be one thing, but that's not the case. They say their just worried about "influence" which is beyond hypocritical and not really grounds for censorship. Should they ban websites hosted in other countries next?
- corimaith 2y ago
  Let's say the CCP were to establish hegemony in the future and even managed to create a bloc of pro-China politicians in US congress. Do you think these notions of free speech will matter then? We've already seen implicit pressure to censor Taiwan or Hong Kong. Like it or not, your freedom to access whatever software you wish is only really possible because you have a state that is capable of resisting foreign pressure to allow you to do so. This move is very much part of that removing leverage from an explicitly illiberal group. Paradox of Intolerance and so forth. You can pridefully choose to reject that, but I don't think your freedoms will last very long then.
  - autoexec 2y ago
    > Let's say the CCP were to establish hegemony in the future and even managed to create a bloc of pro-China politicians in US congress. Do you think these notions of free speech will matter then? I don't think that having access to websites and media in China, alongside all the websites and media from everywhere else on Earth, will result in us electing congressmen who are secretly working for China. There is zero evidence that TikTok is making that happen. There's no evil on TikTok that isn't on facebook and youtube. What good is it for us to voluntarily give up our freedoms in order to keep the China boogeyman from taking them from us?
    - jimbob45 2y ago
      There's no evil on TikTok that isn't on facebook and youtube. Apple has LGBT+ and BLM wallpapers on the phone by default. TikTok only reaches everyone with TikTok installed (and even then, only those that actually uses the app). Apple reaches everyone with an iPhone with its propaganda.

autoexec 2y ago

Not on the payroll of the Chinese government here, and I still think it's terrible for congress to tell us what software we're allowed to run on our own devices or to prevent us from accessing media from other countries. If TikTok were breaking US laws and refused to comply that'd be one thing, but that's not the case. They say their just worried about "influence" which is beyond hypocritical and not really grounds for censorship. Should they ban websites hosted in other countries next?

corimaith 2y ago
Let's say the CCP were to establish hegemony in the future and even managed to create a bloc of pro-China politicians in US congress. Do you think these notions of free speech will matter then? We've already seen implicit pressure to censor Taiwan or Hong Kong. Like it or not, your freedom to access whatever software you wish is only really possible because you have a state that is capable of resisting foreign pressure to allow you to do so. This move is very much part of that removing leverage from an explicitly illiberal group. Paradox of Intolerance and so forth. You can pridefully choose to reject that, but I don't think your freedoms will last very long then.
- autoexec 2y ago
  > Let's say the CCP were to establish hegemony in the future and even managed to create a bloc of pro-China politicians in US congress. Do you think these notions of free speech will matter then? I don't think that having access to websites and media in China, alongside all the websites and media from everywhere else on Earth, will result in us electing congressmen who are secretly working for China. There is zero evidence that TikTok is making that happen. There's no evil on TikTok that isn't on facebook and youtube. What good is it for us to voluntarily give up our freedoms in order to keep the China boogeyman from taking them from us?
  - jimbob45 2y ago
    There's no evil on TikTok that isn't on facebook and youtube. Apple has LGBT+ and BLM wallpapers on the phone by default. TikTok only reaches everyone with TikTok installed (and even then, only those that actually uses the app). Apple reaches everyone with an iPhone with its propaganda.