4 ms·

This is completely incorrect.

by rybosworld 2y ago

deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
greenie_beans 2y ago
how is "socializing" the ownership of a business not socialist?
- rybosworld 2y ago
  The business ownership in a coop is not "socialized". It's still privately owned. The definition of socialism is not, and never has been, "workers owning the means of production." A coop still meets all the characteristics of capitalist entity: - privately owned - for profit, with profits going to shareholders If you think coops are socialist, then you must also think any company that has more than 1 shareholder is socialist. If you think private ownership (which coops protect and uphold) is allowed under socialism, then you don't understand what socialism is.
  - greenie_beans 2y ago
    your opinion about the semantics of "coop" and "socialism" is wrong. most semantic debates are worthless anyway. every socialist i know and have read agree that a coop is a socialist organization, and we will keep creating these enterprises as an alternative to capitalism, until one day, ideally, the capitalist corporations won't be able to compete in the job market with the coops, forcing them to socialize their ownership and power structures. despite whether you think it's socialism or not. here are the 7 cooperative principles. please explain how this is capitalism? https://www.electric.coop/seven-cooperative-principles%E2%80%8B https://www.electric.coop/seven-cooperative-principles%E2%80...
    - rybosworld 2y ago
      There's no semantics. > every socialist i know and have read agree that a coop is a socialist organization Every unicorn I know thinks leprechauns are real. A coop protects and upholds private ownership and distribution of profits to their shareholders. That's not semantics. Socialism does not protect private ownership. Socialism does not distribute profits to shareholders (because there are none). That's also not semantics. If you want to have a non-semantical conversation, the onus is on you.
      - greenie_beans 2y ago
        ok, well you have no idea what you're talking about, so if you think that a coop is capitalism, then i'm gonna use that ignorance to my advantage, and convince everybody that coops are capitalism. psyop coops on the capitalists. thanks for the great strategic idea!
        rybosworld 2y ago
        My guess is that someone who thinks private, for-profit businesses are socialist, will not gain much traction convincing anyone of anything. But best of luck! If you can explain to me how a co-op, which is a privately owned, and for-profit business structure, is not capitalist, I am all ears. P.s. Definitions are important. Hand waving them away as "semantics" is a common trick of the ignorant.
        greenie_beans 2y ago
        lol keep on arguing on the internet about stuff you don't know anything about, comrade. and use poor debate tactics, like "Every unicorn I know thinks leprechauns are real." will really get you far in life.
        rybosworld 2y ago
        Multiple people here have told you that your understanding is incorrect. Now you've resorted to straw man so... I think deep down we all know who is talking out of their behind.

This is completely incorrect.

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]

greenie_beans 2y ago

how is "socializing" the ownership of a business not socialist?

rybosworld 2y ago
The business ownership in a coop is not "socialized". It's still privately owned. The definition of socialism is not, and never has been, "workers owning the means of production." A coop still meets all the characteristics of capitalist entity: - privately owned - for profit, with profits going to shareholders If you think coops are socialist, then you must also think any company that has more than 1 shareholder is socialist. If you think private ownership (which coops protect and uphold) is allowed under socialism, then you don't understand what socialism is.
- greenie_beans 2y ago
  your opinion about the semantics of "coop" and "socialism" is wrong. most semantic debates are worthless anyway. every socialist i know and have read agree that a coop is a socialist organization, and we will keep creating these enterprises as an alternative to capitalism, until one day, ideally, the capitalist corporations won't be able to compete in the job market with the coops, forcing them to socialize their ownership and power structures. despite whether you think it's socialism or not. here are the 7 cooperative principles. please explain how this is capitalism? https://www.electric.coop/seven-cooperative-principles%E2%80%8B https://www.electric.coop/seven-cooperative-principles%E2%80...
  - rybosworld 2y ago
    There's no semantics. > every socialist i know and have read agree that a coop is a socialist organization Every unicorn I know thinks leprechauns are real. A coop protects and upholds private ownership and distribution of profits to their shareholders. That's not semantics. Socialism does not protect private ownership. Socialism does not distribute profits to shareholders (because there are none). That's also not semantics. If you want to have a non-semantical conversation, the onus is on you.
    - greenie_beans 2y ago
      ok, well you have no idea what you're talking about, so if you think that a coop is capitalism, then i'm gonna use that ignorance to my advantage, and convince everybody that coops are capitalism. psyop coops on the capitalists. thanks for the great strategic idea!
      - rybosworld 2y ago
        My guess is that someone who thinks private, for-profit businesses are socialist, will not gain much traction convincing anyone of anything. But best of luck! If you can explain to me how a co-op, which is a privately owned, and for-profit business structure, is not capitalist, I am all ears. P.s. Definitions are important. Hand waving them away as "semantics" is a common trick of the ignorant.
        greenie_beans 2y ago
        lol keep on arguing on the internet about stuff you don't know anything about, comrade. and use poor debate tactics, like "Every unicorn I know thinks leprechauns are real." will really get you far in life.
        rybosworld 2y ago
        Multiple people here have told you that your understanding is incorrect. Now you've resorted to straw man so... I think deep down we all know who is talking out of their behind.