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> When it’s completed, the train will travel at 186 miles per hour If China can push 286 mph in Shanghai, which means the tech exists, then why isn't this comp

> When it’s completed, the train will travel at 186 miles per hour If China can push 286 mph in Shanghai, which means the tech exists, then why isn't this comparable? This is not snark; I am just curious what makes the Chinese train capable of such speeds, but the US train can't.

gs17 2y ago
According to the Wikipedia article about the train, it's now the same speed Brightline is targetting: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shanghai_maglev_train https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shanghai_maglev_train >After May 2021: >Cruising speed: 300 km/h (186 mph) >Average speed: 224 km/h (139 mph) (duration: 8 minutes and 10 seconds) The bigger issue is likely: >According to Chinese media's report, however, due to the huge costs of operating and the lack of the passenger flow, Shanghai Maglev Transportation Company would lose 500 million to 700 million RMB every year
supertrope 2y ago
I’m not fussed with top speeds. Average travel speed that takes into account waiting for the next departure is a more practical measure. A high speed train that stops in every town has a lower effective speed than the top speed suggests. A high speed train with hourly departures instead of every 30 or 15 min means you wait more. And of course high speed means higher cost. The average person is very price sensitive on transportation costs.
AngusH 2y ago
Are you thinking of the Shanghai maglev? It is pretty impressive and they're looking at building an extension. however oddly its operation speed has been significantly reduced from 268mph to 186mph. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shanghai_maglev_train https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shanghai_maglev_train The basic problem is that Maglev is on average more expensive to build and operate and cannot (unlike ordinary high speed rail trains) ever operate on ordinary (non high speed) rail track. It's also still pretty experimental, the Shanghai one is operational and high speed, all other operational systems are either low speed or experimental test beds. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maglev https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maglev Regular high speed rail is a fairly routine thing and all the parts are well understood.
maxglute 2y ago
Typical PRC HSR is 200-220 mph but routes are getting speed upgrades. Infra wise, expensive elevated tracks designed for trains to operate at high speeds unobstructed. Seperate from ground traffic so no worrying about hitting cars and most importantly people. Brightline has highest death rate due to suicides. Someone crunched math of Brightline death per unit of track relative to PRC, if PRC HSR network wasn't elevated theyd have 30000k deaths per year. IMO more important consideration.
- sokoloff 2y ago
  30 million deaths, or 30 thousand?
  - maxglute 2y ago
    30 thousand!
andsoitis 2y ago
> If China can push 286 mph in Shanghai Are you talking about the Maglev train connecting Longyang Road Station on the Shanghai Subway Line 2, to Pudong International Airport? If so, it is only 30km (19mi) long…
jeffchien 2y ago
They're using the I-15 median which can be a little curvy and hilly, so they're probably considering passenger comfort: https://www.flattestroute.com/Las-Vegas-to-Los-Angeles https://www.flattestroute.com/Las-Vegas-to-Los-Angeles
spxneo 2y ago
comparing China's high speed transportation is a low bar. they absolutely do not give a crap about derailment, in fact they straight up buried it, literally instead you should see Japan's shinkansen as a measure of standards. They built that in the sixties
- darknavi 2y ago
  Was just in Japan for the first time and Shinkansen is such a treat. Quiet, fast, clean, spacious. I'd sooo much rather train than take small 1-2 hour flights.
  - spxneo 2y ago
    why doesn't anybody else build this? north america in comparison is stuck in the 19th century when it comes to rail transportation. its bizarre.
    - walthamstow 2y ago
      Having your country destroyed by bombs makes it a lot easier to do greenfield infrastructure projects
      - shiroiushi 2y ago
        That has absolutely nothing to do with it: these projects are mostly through rural areas. The Tokaido shinkansen line is largely underground, in tunnels through mountains. The new Chuo shinkansen maglev line currently being built is 90% underground. What's missing in America is national unity and political will.
        deleted 2y ago
        [deleted]
    - rsynnott 2y ago
      > why doesn't anybody else build this? I mean, most of Europe has, China has, it's not really a case of "nobody else" doing it.
rsynnott 2y ago
That's all of 30km of maglev track. It opened over 20 years ago, and there doesn't seem to be much interest in doing any more. By contrast, there's about _60,000km_ of 'normal' (~300km/h max) high-speed rail. It would really be pretty _weird_ for the US to try beyond-cutting-edge for its first attempt at a real high-speed rail system, and would probably end badly.

gs17 2y ago

According to the Wikipedia article about the train, it's now the same speed Brightline is targetting: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shanghai_maglev_train https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shanghai_maglev_train >After May 2021: >Cruising speed: 300 km/h (186 mph) >Average speed: 224 km/h (139 mph) (duration: 8 minutes and 10 seconds) The bigger issue is likely: >According to Chinese media's report, however, due to the huge costs of operating and the lack of the passenger flow, Shanghai Maglev Transportation Company would lose 500 million to 700 million RMB every year

supertrope 2y ago

I’m not fussed with top speeds. Average travel speed that takes into account waiting for the next departure is a more practical measure. A high speed train that stops in every town has a lower effective speed than the top speed suggests. A high speed train with hourly departures instead of every 30 or 15 min means you wait more. And of course high speed means higher cost. The average person is very price sensitive on transportation costs.

AngusH 2y ago

Are you thinking of the Shanghai maglev? It is pretty impressive and they're looking at building an extension. however oddly its operation speed has been significantly reduced from 268mph to 186mph. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shanghai_maglev_train https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shanghai_maglev_train The basic problem is that Maglev is on average more expensive to build and operate and cannot (unlike ordinary high speed rail trains) ever operate on ordinary (non high speed) rail track. It's also still pretty experimental, the Shanghai one is operational and high speed, all other operational systems are either low speed or experimental test beds. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maglev https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maglev Regular high speed rail is a fairly routine thing and all the parts are well understood.

maxglute 2y ago

Typical PRC HSR is 200-220 mph but routes are getting speed upgrades. Infra wise, expensive elevated tracks designed for trains to operate at high speeds unobstructed. Seperate from ground traffic so no worrying about hitting cars and most importantly people. Brightline has highest death rate due to suicides. Someone crunched math of Brightline death per unit of track relative to PRC, if PRC HSR network wasn't elevated theyd have 30000k deaths per year. IMO more important consideration.

sokoloff 2y ago
30 million deaths, or 30 thousand?
- maxglute 2y ago
  30 thousand!

andsoitis 2y ago

> If China can push 286 mph in Shanghai Are you talking about the Maglev train connecting Longyang Road Station on the Shanghai Subway Line 2, to Pudong International Airport? If so, it is only 30km (19mi) long…

jeffchien 2y ago

They're using the I-15 median which can be a little curvy and hilly, so they're probably considering passenger comfort: https://www.flattestroute.com/Las-Vegas-to-Los-Angeles https://www.flattestroute.com/Las-Vegas-to-Los-Angeles

spxneo 2y ago

comparing China's high speed transportation is a low bar. they absolutely do not give a crap about derailment, in fact they straight up buried it, literally instead you should see Japan's shinkansen as a measure of standards. They built that in the sixties

darknavi 2y ago
Was just in Japan for the first time and Shinkansen is such a treat. Quiet, fast, clean, spacious. I'd sooo much rather train than take small 1-2 hour flights.
- spxneo 2y ago
  why doesn't anybody else build this? north america in comparison is stuck in the 19th century when it comes to rail transportation. its bizarre.
  - walthamstow 2y ago
    Having your country destroyed by bombs makes it a lot easier to do greenfield infrastructure projects
    - shiroiushi 2y ago
      That has absolutely nothing to do with it: these projects are mostly through rural areas. The Tokaido shinkansen line is largely underground, in tunnels through mountains. The new Chuo shinkansen maglev line currently being built is 90% underground. What's missing in America is national unity and political will.
      - deleted 2y ago
        [deleted]
  - rsynnott 2y ago
    > why doesn't anybody else build this? I mean, most of Europe has, China has, it's not really a case of "nobody else" doing it.

rsynnott 2y ago

That's all of 30km of maglev track. It opened over 20 years ago, and there doesn't seem to be much interest in doing any more. By contrast, there's about _60,000km_ of 'normal' (~300km/h max) high-speed rail. It would really be pretty _weird_ for the US to try beyond-cutting-edge for its first attempt at a real high-speed rail system, and would probably end badly.