11 ms·

Sounds so outlandish, but then this comes to mind how the UK tried to ban raves: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criminal_Justice_and_Public_Order_Act_1994 htt

Sounds so outlandish, but then this comes to mind how the UK tried to ban raves: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criminal_Justice_and_Public_Order_Act_1994 https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criminal_Justice_and_Public_... > Sections 63, 64 & 65 of the Act targeted electronic dance music played at raves. The Criminal Justice and Public Order Act empowered police to stop a rave in the open air when "ten or more people are attending, or where two or more are making preparations for a rave". Section 65 allowed any uniformed constable who believes a person is on their way to a rave within a 5-mile (8.0 km) radius to stop them and direct them away from the area; "non-compliant citizens may be subject to a maximum fine not exceeding level 3 on the standard scale (£1000)"

alisonatwork 2y ago
There was an excellent article about this over the weekend: https://www.theguardian.com/culture/2024/apr/20/we-went-from-naive-hippyish-protesters-to-hardcore-anarchists-the-criminal-justice-bill-protests-30-years-on https://www.theguardian.com/culture/2024/apr/20/we-went-from...
hindsightbias 2y ago
Amateurs, ‘Merica fixed this problem two decades back: https://www.congress.gov/bill/107th-congress/senate-bill/2633 https://www.congress.gov/bill/107th-congress/senate-bill/263...
- Tostino 2y ago
  They just can't help them selves with the backronyms can they?! Politicians and the US military must spend a significant proportion of their time coming up with clever names.
  - FredPret 2y ago
    Clever names seem like a waste of time but it’s one of the best things you can do if you want an idea to spread
- thiago_fm 2y ago
  Sponsor was Biden? Interesting.
  - evanelias 2y ago
    Yes, despite his state (Delaware) not even really having a rave scene. He was widely despised among politically-minded folks in the electronic music scene. Biden sponsored the "RAVE Act" as part of his long-term focus on writing extreme "war on drugs" legislation. He previously also wrote the legislation that created the Federal drug czar position, and he was chairman of the Senate Drug Caucus. When it came to drug laws, he was to the right of Reagan and George HW Bush, criticizing them for not being tough enough on drugs.
- FredPret 2y ago
  > “Reducing Americans' Vulnerability to Ecstasy Act” > “ sponsor: Sen. Biden, Joseph R., Jr.%”
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
Intralexical 2y ago
Huh. Suddenly all those Footloose ads on YTV seem a lot less silly. --- https://www.imdb.com/title/tt1068242/ https://www.imdb.com/title/tt1068242/
- 082349872349872 2y ago
  my favourite spinoff of the Footloose franchise is this mashup: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hzRj0aXOHmo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hzRj0aXOHmo "Oh, we got both kinds; we got euro and dance."
  - defrost 2y ago
    That's some pretty Flash Dance'n there: https://www.youtube.com/embed/iJUNznsc4JI?autoplay=1&start=168 https://www.youtube.com/embed/iJUNznsc4JI?autoplay=1&start=1...
    - 082349872349872 2y ago
      Is it true that at Oz parties you all are "dancing on the ceiling"? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u8nRmYj3GTQ&t=4000s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u8nRmYj3GTQ&t=4000s (meanwhile, on the other side of the iron curtain, Александра Овенова gets flowers from someone who thinks she's "first in dance"? https://gorod-812.ru/content/uploads/2020/05/20210307_204836.jpg https://gorod-812.ru/content/uploads/2020/05/20210307_204836... ) EDIT: found the original video (set on Maritius?) for Chikadee: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EGTCMMhfKF0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EGTCMMhfKF0 (in the school scene at ~0:50, the desks are in pairs or triples, as they are in my adoptive country, instead of single, as in the opening scene of "one more time": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C-u5WLJ9Yk4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C-u5WLJ9Yk4 . How are school desks typically arranged in Oz?)
      - defrost 2y ago
        In Australia, as often as possible: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r1V33cWLb_M https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r1V33cWLb_M In not so Soviet Russia no more, Dance is Number One mind control: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RhMYBfF7-hE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RhMYBfF7-hE
IanCal 2y ago
I don't think it really targeted EDM. It just had to have some kind of differentiator in the law about what is a noise and what's music. And > “music” includes sounds wholly or predominantly characterised by the emission of a succession of repetitive beats. Is fairly reasonable. It also seems the law mostly relates to being able to stop the rave and remove people rather than making it a criminal offence to do the thing. > This section applies to a gathering on land in the open air of [F220] or more persons (whether or not trespassers) at which amplified music is played during the night (with or without intermissions) and is such as, by reason of its loudness and duration and the time at which it is played, is likely to cause serious distress to the inhabitants of the locality; and for this purpose— https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1994/33/part/V/crossheading/powers-in-relation-to-raves https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1994/33/part/V/crosshea... Edit - I'm not diving into the depths of this so you are likely be very right in terms of what it's responding to, but I think its important in the framing about what lead to a law and the goal and what it actually says. A law against open air music festivals that cause "distress" may be bad in terms of freedom but it's not as stupid as banning a type of music.
- kelseyfrog 2y ago
  This is going to be great for the ambient music festival scene.
dzhiurgis 2y ago
Also: > legalised anal sex between heterosexual couples 1994 was a wild year for UK
kelnos 2y ago
That's also incredibly dumb, but at least they attempted to criminalize the actual activity they found objectionable. That's at least a rational way to write the law. This BPM law is a complete joke, though, through and through. It won't actually accomplish what they (supposedly) want, and will just cause trouble for people. And to be completely fair, my own country is/was dumb too: in the 1920s many places in the US tried to ban jazz music, and I believe they used tempo as part of the regulations. I don't know if there were ever any laws around it, but rock'n'roll also experienced backlash from establishment types.
- insickness 2y ago
  New York City had laws on the books until 2017 banning dancing in bars that don't have a "caberet license." I remember going out to bars and seeing signs on the wall that said "No dancing." We thought it was a joke until they came up to us and told us to stop dancing. Places could get hefty fines. It took a big activist push to get the law repealed. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York_City_Cabaret_Law https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York_City_Cabaret_Law
  - jackcosgrove 2y ago
    How much did a cabaret license cost?
    - krasin 2y ago
      It appears that it cost a lot (a not just the money; also time + hassle). I quote https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York_City_Cabaret_Law#Cabaret_licensing https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York_City_Cabaret_Law#Caba... >All applicants for a cabaret license had to be fingerprinted; to provide extensive financial records; to meet specific zoning, surveillance, physical security, fire, building, electrical, health, and record keeping requirements; and to pay the fees associated with each compliance. >In 2016, the New York City Department of Consumer Affairs claimed there were then 118 cabaret licenses in a city of 25,100 licensed food service establishments.
  - dcsan 2y ago
jameshart 2y ago
And of course, the crucial legal definition of a rave as a place where the music consists of "sounds wholly or predominantly characterised by the emission of a succession of repetitive beats."
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
- IanCal 2y ago
  No, that's the definition of music not a subtype > “music” includes sounds wholly or predominantly characterised by the emission of a succession of repetitive beats. edit - I should soften this. My understanding here is that it's trying to clarify the difference between some sounds and music. Is a person talking into a mic to a group of people covered by this? No. It's specifically about music. This seems like a very basic description of virtually all music to me.
  - klyrs 2y ago
    Not all music is repetitive. But that which isn't at least a little repetitive (looking at you, free jazz) is rarely considered listenable (or, ahem, musical) by the untrained ear.

alisonatwork 2y ago

There was an excellent article about this over the weekend: https://www.theguardian.com/culture/2024/apr/20/we-went-from-naive-hippyish-protesters-to-hardcore-anarchists-the-criminal-justice-bill-protests-30-years-on https://www.theguardian.com/culture/2024/apr/20/we-went-from...

hindsightbias 2y ago

Amateurs, ‘Merica fixed this problem two decades back: https://www.congress.gov/bill/107th-congress/senate-bill/2633 https://www.congress.gov/bill/107th-congress/senate-bill/263...

Tostino 2y ago
They just can't help them selves with the backronyms can they?! Politicians and the US military must spend a significant proportion of their time coming up with clever names.
- FredPret 2y ago
  Clever names seem like a waste of time but it’s one of the best things you can do if you want an idea to spread
thiago_fm 2y ago
Sponsor was Biden? Interesting.
- evanelias 2y ago
  Yes, despite his state (Delaware) not even really having a rave scene. He was widely despised among politically-minded folks in the electronic music scene. Biden sponsored the "RAVE Act" as part of his long-term focus on writing extreme "war on drugs" legislation. He previously also wrote the legislation that created the Federal drug czar position, and he was chairman of the Senate Drug Caucus. When it came to drug laws, he was to the right of Reagan and George HW Bush, criticizing them for not being tough enough on drugs.
FredPret 2y ago
> “Reducing Americans' Vulnerability to Ecstasy Act” > “ sponsor: Sen. Biden, Joseph R., Jr.%”
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]

Intralexical 2y ago

Huh. Suddenly all those Footloose ads on YTV seem a lot less silly. --- https://www.imdb.com/title/tt1068242/ https://www.imdb.com/title/tt1068242/

082349872349872 2y ago
my favourite spinoff of the Footloose franchise is this mashup: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hzRj0aXOHmo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hzRj0aXOHmo "Oh, we got both kinds; we got euro and dance."
- defrost 2y ago
  That's some pretty Flash Dance'n there: https://www.youtube.com/embed/iJUNznsc4JI?autoplay=1&start=168 https://www.youtube.com/embed/iJUNznsc4JI?autoplay=1&start=1...
  - 082349872349872 2y ago
    Is it true that at Oz parties you all are "dancing on the ceiling"? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u8nRmYj3GTQ&t=4000s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u8nRmYj3GTQ&t=4000s (meanwhile, on the other side of the iron curtain, Александра Овенова gets flowers from someone who thinks she's "first in dance"? https://gorod-812.ru/content/uploads/2020/05/20210307_204836.jpg https://gorod-812.ru/content/uploads/2020/05/20210307_204836... ) EDIT: found the original video (set on Maritius?) for Chikadee: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EGTCMMhfKF0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EGTCMMhfKF0 (in the school scene at ~0:50, the desks are in pairs or triples, as they are in my adoptive country, instead of single, as in the opening scene of "one more time": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C-u5WLJ9Yk4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C-u5WLJ9Yk4 . How are school desks typically arranged in Oz?)
    - defrost 2y ago
      In Australia, as often as possible: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r1V33cWLb_M https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r1V33cWLb_M In not so Soviet Russia no more, Dance is Number One mind control: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RhMYBfF7-hE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RhMYBfF7-hE

IanCal 2y ago

I don't think it really targeted EDM. It just had to have some kind of differentiator in the law about what is a noise and what's music. And > “music” includes sounds wholly or predominantly characterised by the emission of a succession of repetitive beats. Is fairly reasonable. It also seems the law mostly relates to being able to stop the rave and remove people rather than making it a criminal offence to do the thing. > This section applies to a gathering on land in the open air of [F220] or more persons (whether or not trespassers) at which amplified music is played during the night (with or without intermissions) and is such as, by reason of its loudness and duration and the time at which it is played, is likely to cause serious distress to the inhabitants of the locality; and for this purpose— https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1994/33/part/V/crossheading/powers-in-relation-to-raves https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1994/33/part/V/crosshea... Edit - I'm not diving into the depths of this so you are likely be very right in terms of what it's responding to, but I think its important in the framing about what lead to a law and the goal and what it actually says. A law against open air music festivals that cause "distress" may be bad in terms of freedom but it's not as stupid as banning a type of music.

kelseyfrog 2y ago
This is going to be great for the ambient music festival scene.

dzhiurgis 2y ago

Also: > legalised anal sex between heterosexual couples 1994 was a wild year for UK

kelnos 2y ago

That's also incredibly dumb, but at least they attempted to criminalize the actual activity they found objectionable. That's at least a rational way to write the law. This BPM law is a complete joke, though, through and through. It won't actually accomplish what they (supposedly) want, and will just cause trouble for people. And to be completely fair, my own country is/was dumb too: in the 1920s many places in the US tried to ban jazz music, and I believe they used tempo as part of the regulations. I don't know if there were ever any laws around it, but rock'n'roll also experienced backlash from establishment types.

insickness 2y ago
New York City had laws on the books until 2017 banning dancing in bars that don't have a "caberet license." I remember going out to bars and seeing signs on the wall that said "No dancing." We thought it was a joke until they came up to us and told us to stop dancing. Places could get hefty fines. It took a big activist push to get the law repealed. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York_City_Cabaret_Law https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York_City_Cabaret_Law
- jackcosgrove 2y ago
  How much did a cabaret license cost?
  - krasin 2y ago
    It appears that it cost a lot (a not just the money; also time + hassle). I quote https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York_City_Cabaret_Law#Cabaret_licensing https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York_City_Cabaret_Law#Caba... >All applicants for a cabaret license had to be fingerprinted; to provide extensive financial records; to meet specific zoning, surveillance, physical security, fire, building, electrical, health, and record keeping requirements; and to pay the fees associated with each compliance. >In 2016, the New York City Department of Consumer Affairs claimed there were then 118 cabaret licenses in a city of 25,100 licensed food service establishments.
- dcsan 2y ago

jameshart 2y ago

And of course, the crucial legal definition of a rave as a place where the music consists of "sounds wholly or predominantly characterised by the emission of a succession of repetitive beats."

deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
IanCal 2y ago
No, that's the definition of music not a subtype > “music” includes sounds wholly or predominantly characterised by the emission of a succession of repetitive beats. edit - I should soften this. My understanding here is that it's trying to clarify the difference between some sounds and music. Is a person talking into a mic to a group of people covered by this? No. It's specifically about music. This seems like a very basic description of virtually all music to me.
- klyrs 2y ago
  Not all music is repetitive. But that which isn't at least a little repetitive (looking at you, free jazz) is rarely considered listenable (or, ahem, musical) by the untrained ear.