5 ms·

It's almost like it's a totally unnecessary public expenditure at this point, and those funds could be used for, IDK, feeding the homeless?

Cthulhu_ 2y ago
That is a false dichotomy; both are easily affordable by the richest country in the world.
FrontierProject 2y ago
Terribly ironic of you to want to divert library funds to homeless when the homeless are some of the most faithful users of libraries in major cities. Homeless aid organizations even base their programs around libraries.
lolnope11 2y ago
[flagged]
thefaux 2y ago
I'm pretty sure that wasteful library budgets is not a significant factor causing hunger or homelessness.
- veunes 2y ago
  You're absolutely right. Library budgets are typically a small fraction of government spending I think
machomaster 2y ago
If you think that libraries are totally unnecessary public expenditure, then it really tells more about you than about the libraries. The same type of revelation of the person, who says that foodstamps are totally unnecessary expenditure.
al_borland 2y ago
Libraries can be a useful place for homeless, or low income, people to get access to a computer to write up a resume, apply for jobs, etc. The people who forget about libraries are likely well off. Shutting down libraries to feed the homeless doesn’t make sense, as libraries are a tool that can allow them to eventually feed themselves, if well used.
helpfulmandrill 2y ago
If they get rid of the libraries the savings will be used for tax cuts. Guarantee it.
wesselbindt 2y ago
You mentioning helping the homeless in this convo has the same kind of vibe to me as conservatives only mentioning mental health when talking about gun control. They only ever mention mental health as a distraction from issues they do actually care about (like gun control), and have no interest in actually solving mental health issues. It's a typical way of bad faith arguing. That's just vibes though; there's a good chance you'd actually in earnest like to divert library funds toward helping the homeless. It's an issue that's very close to my heart too, so I get the sentiment. Still, I disagree. Just because one of two problems is worse (e.g. literacy and homelessness, or murder and burglary) doesn't mean we can just ignore one problem in favor of another. Just because murder is worse than burglary doesn't mean we should divert all police attention and money currently being spent on burglary to solving murders. Just because women's rights in the US by far surpass those in Saudi Arabia doesn't mean we should take the efforts we put into women's rights issues in the US and divert them to solving women's right's issues in SA. Just because homelessness is in some sense worse than illiteracy and low education doesn't mean we should divert funds from libraries to solving homelessness. Having written all this out, it feels far too obvious for you to not know this. Maybe it's not just vibes.
- linuxftw 2y ago
  I volunteer at my local food bank to help feed to homeless. I understand just how dire the need is. Libraries are a luxury we cannot afford right now, and frankly nobody uses them. Any 'feel good' purpose like 'literacy' is already met by public schools. There's already federal subsidies for internet and telephone for the needy, and the people that live too far away to get internet definitely don't have the money or means to drive into town to use the library. I would be willing to compromise on small buildings that function as internet cafes that are free to use for the public, we can get rid of all the excess staff and books, though.
  - LVB 2y ago
    >and frankly nobody uses them Random stat from my Oregon county (pop. 600k) library collective of 16 local libraries: 2023 saw 10.8M items checked out, up 4% from 2022
veunes 2y ago
libraries remain valuable. They provide access to a wide range of resources to people who are not able to get it
grepLeigh 2y ago
Maybe this isn't as common in your region, but just about every library I've visited provides social services for the homeless. If you search /r/libraries you'll find first-hand accounts from librarians who are committed to serving homeless patrons, even though they didn't sign up for a social worker role. Honestly, I wish I could allocate MORE funds to those kind of people instead of the grifters who profit from the "homeless industrial complex." https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/jan/24/us-libraries-homeless-crisis-social-workers https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/jan/24/us-libraries...

Cthulhu_ 2y ago

That is a false dichotomy; both are easily affordable by the richest country in the world.

FrontierProject 2y ago

Terribly ironic of you to want to divert library funds to homeless when the homeless are some of the most faithful users of libraries in major cities. Homeless aid organizations even base their programs around libraries.

lolnope11 2y ago

[flagged]

thefaux 2y ago

I'm pretty sure that wasteful library budgets is not a significant factor causing hunger or homelessness.

veunes 2y ago
You're absolutely right. Library budgets are typically a small fraction of government spending I think

machomaster 2y ago

If you think that libraries are totally unnecessary public expenditure, then it really tells more about you than about the libraries. The same type of revelation of the person, who says that foodstamps are totally unnecessary expenditure.

al_borland 2y ago

Libraries can be a useful place for homeless, or low income, people to get access to a computer to write up a resume, apply for jobs, etc. The people who forget about libraries are likely well off. Shutting down libraries to feed the homeless doesn’t make sense, as libraries are a tool that can allow them to eventually feed themselves, if well used.

helpfulmandrill 2y ago

If they get rid of the libraries the savings will be used for tax cuts. Guarantee it.

wesselbindt 2y ago

You mentioning helping the homeless in this convo has the same kind of vibe to me as conservatives only mentioning mental health when talking about gun control. They only ever mention mental health as a distraction from issues they do actually care about (like gun control), and have no interest in actually solving mental health issues. It's a typical way of bad faith arguing. That's just vibes though; there's a good chance you'd actually in earnest like to divert library funds toward helping the homeless. It's an issue that's very close to my heart too, so I get the sentiment. Still, I disagree. Just because one of two problems is worse (e.g. literacy and homelessness, or murder and burglary) doesn't mean we can just ignore one problem in favor of another. Just because murder is worse than burglary doesn't mean we should divert all police attention and money currently being spent on burglary to solving murders. Just because women's rights in the US by far surpass those in Saudi Arabia doesn't mean we should take the efforts we put into women's rights issues in the US and divert them to solving women's right's issues in SA. Just because homelessness is in some sense worse than illiteracy and low education doesn't mean we should divert funds from libraries to solving homelessness. Having written all this out, it feels far too obvious for you to not know this. Maybe it's not just vibes.

linuxftw 2y ago
I volunteer at my local food bank to help feed to homeless. I understand just how dire the need is. Libraries are a luxury we cannot afford right now, and frankly nobody uses them. Any 'feel good' purpose like 'literacy' is already met by public schools. There's already federal subsidies for internet and telephone for the needy, and the people that live too far away to get internet definitely don't have the money or means to drive into town to use the library. I would be willing to compromise on small buildings that function as internet cafes that are free to use for the public, we can get rid of all the excess staff and books, though.
- LVB 2y ago
  >and frankly nobody uses them Random stat from my Oregon county (pop. 600k) library collective of 16 local libraries: 2023 saw 10.8M items checked out, up 4% from 2022

veunes 2y ago

libraries remain valuable. They provide access to a wide range of resources to people who are not able to get it

grepLeigh 2y ago

Maybe this isn't as common in your region, but just about every library I've visited provides social services for the homeless. If you search /r/libraries you'll find first-hand accounts from librarians who are committed to serving homeless patrons, even though they didn't sign up for a social worker role. Honestly, I wish I could allocate MORE funds to those kind of people instead of the grifters who profit from the "homeless industrial complex." https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/jan/24/us-libraries-homeless-crisis-social-workers https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/jan/24/us-libraries...