4 ms·

It's great for VW's competitors

ProllyInfamous 3y ago
After today's vote, all VW assembly production facilities are organized/Union.
toomuchtodo 3y ago
All automakers will end up unionized (majority vote wins), and unable to offshore due to deglobalization and incentives that require they produce in the US. The “you’ll regret this” threat holds no water in the go forward macro. Mercedes, Tesla, Rivian, and Lucid are all who are left in the US. Exciting times to have some hope.
- jjtheblunt 3y ago
  BMW south carolina?
  - toomuchtodo 3y ago
    I am mistaken, you are correct. BMW and Volvo both have plants in SC that haven’t unionized yet.
    - jjtheblunt 3y ago
      If BMW and Volvo offer better benefits than UAW, why would the employees there unionize? (i don't know that they do offer better benefits, but you look like you asserted everyone would unionize...whereas the employer with adequate and preferable benefits could itself be the union, functionally)
      - toomuchtodo 3y ago
        Without a union, you have no agency. The deal can change at anytime with no recourse. Contracts bind, but require collective bargaining.
        jjtheblunt 3y ago
        Does to not have agency imply the workers are fungible, replaces left cogs in a machine, unlike in other domains where “stars” exist and thereby have agency?
        toomuchtodo 3y ago
        I argue there is strong evidence “stars” are lucky, not legitimately exceptional, in a majority of cases (“myth of meritocracy”). Most people cannot negotiate a better deal individually for compensation, working arrangements, etc. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Myth_of_meritocracy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Myth_of_meritocracy https://www.scientificamerican.com/blog/beautiful-minds/the-role-of-luck-in-life-success-is-far-greater-than-we-realized/ https://www.scientificamerican.com/blog/beautiful-minds/the-... https://hbr.org/2021/06/dont-underestimate-the-power-of-luck-when-it-comes-to-success-in-business https://hbr.org/2021/06/dont-underestimate-the-power-of-luck... Are we optimizing for a lucky few? Or the majority? That’s the philosophical question I believe. If majority votes win union elections, and organizing is the only way to seek some power against corporate interests, the action required is obvious as a rationalist. I understand that a minority will take issue with the advantage they might have diminished or lose entirely, but by definition, stars are a minority. https://www.axios.com/2024/03/20/union-workers-wealth-comparison-pay-difference https://www.axios.com/2024/03/20/union-workers-wealth-compar... https://home.treasury.gov/news/featured-stories/labor-unions-and-the-us-economy https://home.treasury.gov/news/featured-stories/labor-unions... https://www.americanprogress.org/article/workers-want-unions-how-states-have-strengthened-worker-power-in-2023/ https://www.americanprogress.org/article/workers-want-unions...
        jjtheblunt 3y ago
        Great useful response: thank you.
        toomuchtodo 3y ago
        Happy to help. We must empower the human to live the best life they can in a system they have little input in, and improve systems that allow for exploitation whenever possible.

After today's vote, all VW assembly production facilities are organized/Union.

All automakers will end up unionized (majority vote wins), and unable to offshore due to deglobalization and incentives that require they produce in the US. The “you’ll regret this” threat holds no water in the go forward macro. Mercedes, Tesla, Rivian, and Lucid are all who are left in the US. Exciting times to have some hope.

jjtheblunt 3y ago
BMW south carolina?
- toomuchtodo 3y ago
  I am mistaken, you are correct. BMW and Volvo both have plants in SC that haven’t unionized yet.
  - jjtheblunt 3y ago
    If BMW and Volvo offer better benefits than UAW, why would the employees there unionize? (i don't know that they do offer better benefits, but you look like you asserted everyone would unionize...whereas the employer with adequate and preferable benefits could itself be the union, functionally)
    - toomuchtodo 3y ago
      Without a union, you have no agency. The deal can change at anytime with no recourse. Contracts bind, but require collective bargaining.
      - jjtheblunt 3y ago
        Does to not have agency imply the workers are fungible, replaces left cogs in a machine, unlike in other domains where “stars” exist and thereby have agency?
        toomuchtodo 3y ago
        I argue there is strong evidence “stars” are lucky, not legitimately exceptional, in a majority of cases (“myth of meritocracy”). Most people cannot negotiate a better deal individually for compensation, working arrangements, etc. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Myth_of_meritocracy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Myth_of_meritocracy https://www.scientificamerican.com/blog/beautiful-minds/the-role-of-luck-in-life-success-is-far-greater-than-we-realized/ https://www.scientificamerican.com/blog/beautiful-minds/the-... https://hbr.org/2021/06/dont-underestimate-the-power-of-luck-when-it-comes-to-success-in-business https://hbr.org/2021/06/dont-underestimate-the-power-of-luck... Are we optimizing for a lucky few? Or the majority? That’s the philosophical question I believe. If majority votes win union elections, and organizing is the only way to seek some power against corporate interests, the action required is obvious as a rationalist. I understand that a minority will take issue with the advantage they might have diminished or lose entirely, but by definition, stars are a minority. https://www.axios.com/2024/03/20/union-workers-wealth-comparison-pay-difference https://www.axios.com/2024/03/20/union-workers-wealth-compar... https://home.treasury.gov/news/featured-stories/labor-unions-and-the-us-economy https://home.treasury.gov/news/featured-stories/labor-unions... https://www.americanprogress.org/article/workers-want-unions-how-states-have-strengthened-worker-power-in-2023/ https://www.americanprogress.org/article/workers-want-unions...
        jjtheblunt 3y ago
        Great useful response: thank you.
        toomuchtodo 3y ago
        Happy to help. We must empower the human to live the best life they can in a system they have little input in, and improve systems that allow for exploitation whenever possible.