5 ms·

Interesting they use the word 'private' in their strapline, after all they frame themselves as private search albeit they don't have their own search engine and

Interesting they use the word 'private' in their strapline, after all they frame themselves as private search albeit they don't have their own search engine and market themselves as a privacy search engine. Their index is essentially Bing and they're hosted on Microsoft IPs. So not exactly ideal.

binarymax 3y ago
But none of your personal details are sent to Bing? Sure they get some SERPS from them, but DDG abstracts in front of Bing's API using your query without passing your data.
JAlexoid 3y ago
The privacy comes from the lack of tracking your interests and tailoring the search results to the preexisting interests. They just don't collect the private data in the first place.
- ricardo81 3y ago
  That's one way of looking at it. Another way is that your PII like your IP hitting a MS server and searches being returned for that searcher are heavily correlated. They can't serve results like https://duckduckgo.com/?t=ftsa&q=shops+near+me&ia=web https://duckduckgo.com/?t=ftsa&q=shops+near+me&ia=web and return shops within miles of me without passing that info on. IIRC they pass the /24 of your IP, but all the same, not much better.
  - JAlexoid 3y ago
    No, your IP is not "you". It's most definitely not your PII, per se. It is PII when used in conjunction with other data(even under fairly strict GPDR rules). The party storing the IP must have means of associating that IP with you, not simply "a city". I mean... I can write an anonymous letter, drop it into the mailbox of my local post office and there will be a stamp of where and when that letter was mailed from. Is a post office stamp now my personal information?
    - ricardo81 3y ago
      EU law says your IP is PII. When you have the /24 of a searcher, and assets on X% of websites where that same IP accesses clicking through from a search, I mean, it's well known that this is not very private. And also doing xx searches a day. The idea of anonymity becomes a fantasy.
      - yegg 3y ago
        We don't pass any parts of the IP to anyone.
        ricardo81 3y ago
        Sure, in the case of this specific tool. But the point of something being demonstrably 'private' is diminished based on your usage of the word in other contexts. And again, hitting Microsoft IPs. Microsoft have assets on many websites, so the correlation is trivial over time, no specific IP needed, no cookies needed.
      - JAlexoid 3y ago
        No. That's utterly wrong interpretation, according to ECJ. IP is not PII per se(on it's own, if you don't understand that phrase) If it's hard to understand, it's the same with phone numbers. Your phone number is PII, yet in every country with an option to move your phone number to another phone line provider - they are all very much not private... And telco can check if your phone number is in use, and not only telco. Phone numbers are significantly more private than IPs.
  - threecheese 3y ago
    Does DDG provide Bing with your location (/24 or some other proxy) always, or only in the case of the local search in your example? Which seems like a minimal privacy violation (Can’t have “What’s nearby” and “I don’t want to tell you where I am”, but I get your beef; you want DDG to localize results instead of M$).

binarymax 3y ago

But none of your personal details are sent to Bing? Sure they get some SERPS from them, but DDG abstracts in front of Bing's API using your query without passing your data.

JAlexoid 3y ago

The privacy comes from the lack of tracking your interests and tailoring the search results to the preexisting interests. They just don't collect the private data in the first place.

ricardo81 3y ago
That's one way of looking at it. Another way is that your PII like your IP hitting a MS server and searches being returned for that searcher are heavily correlated. They can't serve results like https://duckduckgo.com/?t=ftsa&q=shops+near+me&ia=web https://duckduckgo.com/?t=ftsa&q=shops+near+me&ia=web and return shops within miles of me without passing that info on. IIRC they pass the /24 of your IP, but all the same, not much better.
- JAlexoid 3y ago
  No, your IP is not "you". It's most definitely not your PII, per se. It is PII when used in conjunction with other data(even under fairly strict GPDR rules). The party storing the IP must have means of associating that IP with you, not simply "a city". I mean... I can write an anonymous letter, drop it into the mailbox of my local post office and there will be a stamp of where and when that letter was mailed from. Is a post office stamp now my personal information?
  - ricardo81 3y ago
    EU law says your IP is PII. When you have the /24 of a searcher, and assets on X% of websites where that same IP accesses clicking through from a search, I mean, it's well known that this is not very private. And also doing xx searches a day. The idea of anonymity becomes a fantasy.
    - yegg 3y ago
      We don't pass any parts of the IP to anyone.
      - ricardo81 3y ago
        Sure, in the case of this specific tool. But the point of something being demonstrably 'private' is diminished based on your usage of the word in other contexts. And again, hitting Microsoft IPs. Microsoft have assets on many websites, so the correlation is trivial over time, no specific IP needed, no cookies needed.
    - JAlexoid 3y ago
      No. That's utterly wrong interpretation, according to ECJ. IP is not PII per se(on it's own, if you don't understand that phrase) If it's hard to understand, it's the same with phone numbers. Your phone number is PII, yet in every country with an option to move your phone number to another phone line provider - they are all very much not private... And telco can check if your phone number is in use, and not only telco. Phone numbers are significantly more private than IPs.
- threecheese 3y ago
  Does DDG provide Bing with your location (/24 or some other proxy) always, or only in the case of the local search in your example? Which seems like a minimal privacy violation (Can’t have “What’s nearby” and “I don’t want to tell you where I am”, but I get your beef; you want DDG to localize results instead of M$).